Bush Lied!!! The Gop Lied!!

Discussion in 'Politics' started by TM_Direct, Sep 4, 2003.

  1. After an eighteen-month investigation that uncovered explosive new evidence through interviews and in classified documents, Gerald Posner reveals much previously undisclosed information:

    • the identity of two countries that might have had foreknowledge that a terrorist attack was scheduled for September 11 on U.S. soil
    • a startling account of the interrogation of a leading al Qaeda captive
    • facts about a series of deaths that point to an ongoing conspiracy by some governments to hide the extent of their earlier relationships with al Qaeda
    • details about a secret deal between Saudi Arabia and Osama bin Laden
    • how the U.S. government missed several chances to kill or capture bin Laden
    • evidence that German intelligence may have protected an informant who was involved with many of the 9/11 plotters
    • how the CIA tracked—and then lost—two of the hijackers when they entered the United States more than twenty months before the attacks
    • the devastating consequences of the crippling rivalry between the CIA and FBI as the United States moved unwittingly toward 9/11

    In a dramatic narrative, Why America Slept exposes the frequent mistakes made by law enforcement and government agencies, and demonstrates how the failures to prevent 9/11 were tragically not an exception but typical. Along the way, by delving into terror financing, the links between far-flung terror organizations, and how the United States responded over the years to other attacks, Posner also makes a damning case that 9/11 could have been prevented.

    Why America Slept lays to rest two years of conjecture about what led up to the worst terror attacks in America’s history. This breakthrough book presents an infuriating review of how incompetence and misplaced priorities made America an easy target for terrorists.

    From the Back Cover
    In the end, the central question that remained was what did American intelligence and law enforcement know and what did they ignore? What mistakes were made along the way on the ground by police, FBI and CIA, and in Washington and state capitals by policy makers? While hunting for those answers, there were unexpected discoveries about some American allies, and what they might have known, and not told anyone, before 9/11. The result is a far more infuriating book than originally expected. The failure to have prevented 9/11 was a systematic one. It is not just that investigators failed to get a lucky break early on, nor is it really even dependent on a series of blunders in the immediate run-up to the attack. The seeds for failure were sown repeatedly in almost twenty years of fumbled investigations and misplaced priorities. After a while, the revelations of ineptitude presented in this book no longer cause surprise, but only anger.
    —from Why America Slept

    About the Author
    Gerald Posner, a former Wall Street lawyer, is an award-winning author of eight books on subjects ranging from Nazi war criminals, to assassinations, to the careers of politicians. A regular panelist on the History Channel’s HistoryCENTER, he has also written for many national publications, including The New York Times, The New Yorker, Time, Newsweek, The Wall Street Journal, and U.S. News & World Report. He lives in Miami and New York City with his wife, the author Trisha Posner.


    ( From text on Amazon.Com )
     
    #31     Sep 22, 2003
  2. it was foreigner who committed 9/11 - theres no reason to crack down on the civil liberties of US citizens - that is what they have done with things like the patriot act. Cali giving drivers license to illegals - along with other states doing the same. put our troops on the borders and protect us from invasion.

    the US placed 3rd in executions in 2002 - behind China (#1) and Iran (#2) - you really think we need to execute more than these countries?

    but we do better with juveniles -
    "Amnesty International knows of only 12 executions of juvenile offenders worldwide in the past four years: three in Iran, one in the Democratic Republic of Congo and eight in the United States."
     
    #32     Sep 22, 2003
  3. bobcathy1

    bobcathy1 Guest

    Ok, do you really care about the civil liberties of violent criminals? I don't murder. So as far as I am concerned throw away the damn key!

    Only 8 kids? I am amazed. We live in a violent society. And yes, I am all for capital punishment for murder. Don't do the crime if you can't face dying yourself.

    Yes and I agree, tighten up the borders. But be really careful who we leave inside of the fences.......that is what scares me.....that the mass murderers are living here already.:(

    PS....I am for decriminalizing drugs, vice crimes, freedom of speech and expression, alternate lifestyles and a whole bunch of things in far left field.
     
    #33     Sep 22, 2003
  4. Woah woah woah ... First of all, you're assuming they are definitely guilty and have been proven so in a court of law. The people at Guantanamo Bay are being held "indefinitely" under the title "enemy combatants."

    This will also get used for U.S. citizens inside the United States. So, if they are truly proven in a court of law to be a criminal, than sure, you can throw away the damn key. But you're suggesting we throw away the damn key on potentially innocent people.

    What if I was an FBI agent and stormed YOUR house right now, took Bob away and held him in an undisclosed location without benefit of speaking to an attorney? Would you want me to throw away the damn key to Bob's cell? Perhaps we thought Bob was a major distributor of cocaine, but there is a possibility that we were wrong (as the government is at times). Where is the justice now? Have I violated your and Bob's civil rights? How does THAT feel?
     
    #34     Sep 22, 2003
  5. ya bet ya they're guilty. Bush doctrine says so. How dare you question it?:mad: Din't you congressman sign Patriot I? Mine did.
    Powers that be says yer suspect, it's over baby.. curtains. What civil liberties? are you kidding me?. This is New America baby, if you don't like it what's ya gonna do about it? :eek:

    GW for President again!!! goooooo GW:cool:

    :D :D :D


    Coming to think about it, hmmm.......... Aphexcoil you sound like a suspect to me, questioning the rules and the powerful? be carefull now.....you could be headed over sea water soon:D :D
     
    #35     Sep 22, 2003
  6. I mean, yeah .. you're joking about it but the sad part is that this is the kind of state we're heading for if we don't put the breaks on and do a reality check.
     
    #37     Sep 22, 2003
  7. bobcathy1

    bobcathy1 Guest

    Aphie....
    You assumed something I did not intend.

    I would throw away the key AFTER they had been found guilty in a court and exhausted their appeals. And in cases of violent crime, not moral ones. I have had friends who have been murdered. Bob was a cop. Makes a difference in my attitude.

    The people in Gitmo are going to have to be set free eventually. Unless they really did commit a crime. Then they need to go to prison in their own country. They are POWs and will be kept until the end of the war like usual. Castro wants us to leave Cuba too. It is totally weird we have a military base in a country we do not speak to. :confused:

    Also in my post I did say I am for the leagalization of drugs, prostitution and abolition of antiquated laws like that. Ugly guys have to get laid too!

    And I really do not see our rights being violated in the US any more than usual. :D Since I am older, I have more history to go on than you do. The world stays the same unfortunatly. When you are young, you get passionate about change. When you are old you realize it will never happen. :(
     
    #38     Sep 23, 2003
  8. That's fine -- but what I'm hoping that doesn't happen is that the United States government detains an innocent person indefinitely through a state of legal limbo. What good is our country if we preach values of liberty and justice to the rest of the world if we do not follow our own sermon in our backyard?

    I know you are a lot older than me (MILF), but just in my short little 26 years, I've already seen a lot of changes within this country. Some of it is naturally due to what happened on September 11 and thus warranted. However, how far are we going to take it -- especially when you look at laws that have since originated such as the Patriot Act, the DMCA and other laws that really infringe on civil liberties.

    We have to stop and ask ourselves what the hell is going on when our government gives a corporation (such as the RIAA) the ability to issue subpoenas to citizens. This is a small example of a much larger problem. You or I may yet to feel the effects of it, but that doesn't mean that other people aren't feeling it right now.
     
    #39     Sep 23, 2003
  9. Welcome to the real world Aphie....your points are well taken and i agree with what you are saying and fearing....but on the flip side, as i tried to not earlier but nobody responded ( except for you ) was the Patriot act effects....we are all screaming and yelling why the government didn't;t add up all the pieces ahead of time for the last ten years....yet now as we try to prevent it from happening again, we are screaming about our individual rights..too many , especially on this board label Ashcroft a Fascist or nazi .....yet I have not heard one counter argument thatmakes logic or sense in terms of national security....I will admit I don;t have the answers either...but i think we are doing a good balancing job of keeping us protected while at the same time preserving the mass publics rights...it's a tough job he has and Im kind of curious what others would do if given the power? Phone taps? big brother listening? arresting a terror suspect and holding him indefinitely?
     
    #40     Sep 23, 2003