ABCNEWS: Bush Acknowledges Iraq 'Could Be' Like Vietnam... Wed Oct 18 2006 18:45:10 ET Below is a portion of the transcript from ABC News' George Stephanopoulos' Interview with President George W. Bush: CLIP STEPHANOPOULOS: It's been a brutal month in Iraq. BUSH: That's right. STEPHANOPOULOS: Yesterday, 11 Americans killed, another American killed today. On a day like that, what kind of reports do you get from the battlefield? BUSH: Well, I get that report, that soldiers were killed... STEPHANOPOULOS: Every casualty. BUSH: Yeah, absolutely, I read every casualty, and it breaks my heart, because behind every casualty is somebody with tears in their eyes. Behind every casualty are families that will be mourning the loss of life for a lifetime. I think the hardest part of the presidency is to meet with families who've lost a loved one. // STEPHANOPOULOS: Tom Friedman wrote in the New York Times this morning that what we might be seeing now is the Iraqi equivalent of the Tet offensive... BUSH: Yeah. STEPHANOPOULOS: ... in Vietnam in 1968. Tony Snow this morning said he may be right. BUSH: Mm-hmm. STEPHANOPOULOS: Do you agree? BUSH: He could be right. There's certainly a stepped up level of violence, and we're heading into an election. STEPHANOPOULOS: But what's your gut tell you? BUSH: George, my gut tells me that they have all along been trying to inflict enough damage that we'd leave. And the leaders of Al Qaida have made that very clear. CLIP Developing... http://www.drudgereport.com/flash2.htm
I think the analogy is imperfect at best. In Vietnam, we faced an invading army from the North that was trying to defeat us by attrition so they could take over the country. In Iraq the vast majority of the violence is sectarian, aimed at other Iraqis in a struggle for control of the oil wealth and the government. Some factions want us gone, others do not. The similarities are that the enemy in both wars was highly skilled at public relations, had majorities of Democrats in congress supporting them and had the unquestioned support of our major media.
_________________________________________________ Z10 as always and in his limited ability way misses the point that Bush made and correctly so that the enemy, through an offensive is trying to influence their friends like Z10 and the MSM shortly before an election. As if they could be made to be anymore anti-US.
The analogy had nothing to do with the enemy, their objectives and tactics. The analogy referred to the fact that the war in Iraq much like Vietnam is an unwinnable quagmire. The analogy is perfect in this respect. Unlike Vietnam though this outcome of the war in Iraq was predicted by too many people in this country and in the world and was nevertheless ignored by our "brave", "resolute" leaders.
I disagree that Vietnam was an unwinnable quagmire. We made it that by the way we prosecuted the war, with one arm tied behind our backs courtesy of a Democrat congress that was determined Nixon would not score a win on their watch. The situation in Iraq is both more complex, due to the number of players, and simpler, due to the fact that we don't have to worry about a superpower backing one faction. The main reason we have the security situation we do now in Iraq is that we have managed the war more to avoid criticism from the "world community' over excess force than to prevail.
Another idiotic, shallow post. Did LBJ even ask Congress for a resolution of war in Viret Nam? Nam was UNDECLARED! We've lost 5% as many boys in Iraq as we did in Viet Nam. Stop the bullshit spinning.
The point is not how we got there, I am sure there were better ways to prosecute the war in Vietnam, I am sure 5 years from now you (rightwingers) will be screaming that the war in Iraq was winnable as well if it was not for those damn pacifists/liberals/democrats... The point is that Iraq today is an unwinnable quagmire, just like Vietnam was. We are losing troops, the situation on the ground is getting worse not better, the local population hates us and assists our enemies, we cannot withdraw, we cannot stay either, we don't even have the definition of victory. The situations are certainly not identical but they are similar enough to make the analogy valid.
There is a hugh difference between Vietnam and Iraq. Without the difference the invasion of Iraq would be LIKE the war in Vietnam where the USA is getting their butts wiped and indeed losing. I firmly believe we all know in our heart of hearts that we not only are losing but will find a way to CLAIM victory as we high tail out as soon as we build the bases and control the oil fields. Cheney, Rummy and the Pentagon did not want another Vietnam on their hands as they pre-plan the middle east invasion, Iraq being the first domino to fall (they assumed). They needed a scheme to get over this stumbling block. What to do? Picture this: Someone walks into Rummys office and hands him a memo that states clear and concise plans of some stretched, pissed off Saudi that has roamed off the reservation and is planning to hijack some airplanes and take out the twin towers etc. Rummy immediately gets goose bumps and dashes over to see Cheney with this memo, YEP, Cheney also gets goose bumps and possibly even a woodie for the first time in a decade. He says to Rummy........."this is exactly what we have been looking for, PERFECT COVER to go into Iraq." Rummy, gets a big juicy kiss. Thats the REASON the invasion of Iraq was able to go forward. AMERICA was hit at home and the terror card COVER was born. With the terror card as cover for invading we could scare the crap out of the public into thinking we are on the very edge of distinction from "EVIL DOER"S". OK, forget the conspiracy theory, many can not fathom their precious right wing "values" puppets would actually let an event like taking out a couple measly bldgs in order to push the invasion plan happen (hahahaha). But, indeed even if not pre-planned, it surely came to the front burner before the smoke cleared in Manhattan. The idea of America being attacked was perfect cover to keep the public from marching in the streets and at the Universities as happened in Vietnam. Todays youth are pattycake pansies, they get lied to and they stay passive, they are wimpy panty waste. Bush team has whipped the invasion with terror into stupefying the public into mush. Workers are scarty cats to fight for fair wages and bennies, gee, lets all go take a minimum wage job and no healthcare for the kids etc. America is a bunch of losers. Thank You for you kind and wonderful understanding..............
The vast majority of Vietnam vets, the ones who would know, disagree with that. I happen to know that you're a Vietnam vet, so I do acknowledge that you know more about it than I. It's interesting to me that after everything that has been written and said about Vietnam, there are still people who believe that the problem wasn't 1) An enemy they couldn't find 2) A style of warfare they were unprepared for, in geographical terms, and 3) The reality that the enemy were ready to die and send their children and their children's children in to die. The Russians had no hand tied behind their backs in Afghanistan and they finally left. Exactly the same thing in Vietnam Same problem in Iraq, for different reasons. It's really hard to fight brainwashed robots. To blame the democrats for the US failure in Vietnam seems partisan to me. I do know that you have been vocal in your criticism of the current strategy, I just feel that it's inaccurate to say that Vietnam was messed up because of the democrats.