Bund/Bobl/Shatz Paper where are you?

Discussion in 'Index Futures' started by jeremyaves, Sep 13, 2005.

  1. Well done to whoever flipped me about like a chicken yesterday morning. I should know better than to trade size in a market with no paper.

    Just remember, no one is too big for any market and you will get lifted on all your spoof bids or offers sooner rather than later, its just a matter of time before you get ironed out.

    Any way, I can only take my hat off to you because you are very good at what you do. Sometimes it's easy to gauge what your position is, then (like yesterday) you mask it well and mugs like me lose their heads and forget to look at the big picture.

    We all know that you break the rules by selling a load of shatz to yourself before taking it up etc etc. Eurex won't do anything because you are their volume. However cheats never prosper and despite your massive wealth there is someone waiting in the midst to take all your ticks off of you.

    So thanks for reminding me yesterday that if you trade anything more than 400's in the bobl you are likely to be countertraded with. I needed a wake up call and will remember to keep it small in the morning and start playing again when our American friends join the party.

    Once again you are a fucking genius but I detest the way you manipulate the market. Make sure you bank plenty of your money because you won't be the first or last person to give it all back.

    No one is bigger than the market. Not even you and the chimps you cross contracts up with.
  2. bsmith


    Jeremy I loved reading your rant. Really struck a chord.
  3. Maybe the nice looking young lady who was on cnbc's "top traders under 30" segment it taking your money
  4. This week has definately not suited my style of trading so I will be found in the short end until there is more flow. Good luck everyone. Don't let the cheat shake you out.
  5. :)....:p
  6. butkus


    you should edit your original post from

    "I detest the way you manipulate the market"


    "I detest the way I allow myself to be manipulated by the market"

    These trading games and techniques have been around for a long time and will be around for a long time to come. It's part of trading and money can be made by recognizing these tactics. Of course, the recognition is the challenge, and I would suggest focusing your energy towards improving this skill, rather than getting angry.
  7. Hello,

    I've been trading the bund solid for the last 3 weeks and was wondering if you could give some examples of this 'flipping' as i'm quite intrigued to see exactly what the beef is about. At the moment i'm seeing some large orders go through -say 3400 lots, which knocks my strategy for six but am still not aware of a 'flipper' influence in the markets, or maybe i'm missing something.

    Much apreciated in advance,

  8. Urkel


    When u feel like this just scream out "Nice Hand" at your monitor, lol. I deal with what your talking about in the US 10 year daily. Doubt anyone is actually trading with themselves though.
  9. Thanks Buktus!

    Next time the rules are blatantly broken and I cut my long/short because of illegal market manipulation I'll remember your words of wisdom and stand on my desk screaming-

    'I detest the way I allow myself to be manipulated by the market.'

    I will then take a deep breath and remain calm as my original position goes onside and smile, even though I got out of it five ticks lower/higher. I will not forget to congratulate the likes of you for having balls of steel and staying in the position that is now not only 5 ticks onside, but 10 with a fucking flake on top.

    This year I will trade well over 2 million round turns in the bund/bobl/shatz spreading the curve. (What a hero!)

    I am not a legend but make a living. You will find me there for bids and offers when perhaps you need something to lean on. If ten people who trade similar styles and volumes to myself decide to trade another market the annual volume goes down 24 million, the equivalent of losing ten busy days.

    In the mornig sessions over the last 2 months I have never had so many part fills. Why? because people aren't playing. The reason, you know the reason.

    Number one target for the manipulator is the local, he knows the pain threshold is 2/3/4 mayby five ticks and is very good at topping and tailing us. He has been successfully sorting out the wheat from the chaff for the last two and a half years.
    But what happens when there is no wheat left? You will end up with a market that is 23/25 my old friend, I'll be 34a when you miss the fives and it gaps 9 ticks. What, they weren't there! Youv'e missed them, I'm 36b or am I? I don't want to do them, yes I do, no I don't, I'll sell them to myself, 40 bid. Rate cut, China, Figure, Bomb, no bomb, Flip, Bush, off that, Oil, shit non-farm, rumour, Stocks, Euro, flip, "What's there?", revised, back to where it was, Pint, yes please. "That fucking flipper,I hate him but isn't he good!" Fancy another? Oh, go on, bollocks.


    :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:
  10. There'll be others to play wheat. Besides, taking money from chaff is easier.

    If you can make a solid case for manipulation, don't moan to Eurex, talk to BaFin, they'll jump on it. If you can't make a solid case, well...
    #10     Sep 16, 2005