Apologies that I searched Google for an image of a Dell 8300 and chose the 1st one that matched the one I had as I no longer have that machine, though you had the same PSU issue with it so I'm not sure who gets the win on that point. Maybe I'll sort by date and find one that's newer; why not. FYI, that machine was delivered from Dell on 11/30/04 per a query to my Dell account just now. By my count that is 5 years and change, hardly the 10 years you're saying, and I never said this issue happened in the last year or 2...it was 4 years ago. Yes, I own a 9200 here and it's much better than the 8300 but I stand by my assertion that they are far less friendly than a BIY in terms of HW replacement. Yes, the newer Dell's and other OEM machines are better with the power supply issue but still not 100% the same as a case you'd buy from Fry's, etc. Might it require a little jury rigging to get it to fit perfectly? Maybe, maybe not, and I guess that's not so difficult for most users but it's still a PITA. It's certainly better but that's just one of the issues with a Dell or HP or what not. You're eating out of their hand for support, HW compatibility and so forth. And I can't say for certainty, but let's say your PSU failed on you and you needed to go buy a new one and you got it installed by yourself...wouldn't that now void your warranty as you're now using a 3rd party piece of HW? If so, that's a genuine concern. Do failures happen all that often? No, but when they do they need to be addressed immediately and properly and I'm sorry but a best case scenario of 24 hours is a lot worse than a lunch trip to Fry's. Why are you so anti-BIY or rather pro-Dell? I, myself, am pro-BIY for the following reasons: - Price - Ease of assembly, support from users and manufacturers - Availability of replacement parts, should the need arise - Less down-time vs. OEM's needing warranty replacement - Control of every single piece of HW and software that runs on the system and anti-OEM (in this case Dell, but everyone will suffer the same) for the following reasons: - Price ($414.99 savings versus a comparable Dell, though that Dell did not have 64-bit Win7 as I used) - Control over HW parts/assembly - Control over installed software/bloatware - Ability to get EXACTLY what you want, not a menu of choices - Dependence on shoddy customer service I think that in a thread espousing the benefits of BIY systems when someone comes in and calls me out and implies that their OEM's don't suffer then you have to expect this kind of response. I'm no computer builder or anything more than a guy that knows his way around a computer; smarter than the average bear, I guess. I've owned more Dell's that pretty much everyone here so don't say that I haven't put in plenty of time and effort into formulating my opinions. I don't understand what the argument for an OEM machine is versus a BIY system except the warranty, which can actually be a detriment as there's an opportunity cost associated with a warranty: TIME. Of course, YMMV and you're entitled to your own opinion and I respect that I just don't agree with it as of yet. I'd love to hear your reasons FOR Dell or other OEM's over the BIY route rather than just making petty jabs at the age of a photo. I'm not being an asshole, I genuinely want to hear WHY you love Dell; maybe it will help change how I feel about them, though you're not going swing me back to the Dell-side of the spectrum as I'm happy with BIY.
I disagree. My credentials: 1. I can read / follow instructions 2. I am logical and can search for assistance, if the need arises 3. I have a multi-tool / screwdriver for assembly Is there really anything else you need?? LOL I don't mean to downplay it so much but in all honesty it really is not as hard as people would have you think. It's not exactly rocket science and I'd argue that it's almost more difficult to cook than it is to assemble a computer. No, I don't build my own cars, TV, etc. but that's a little silly now, isn't it? Do you honestly know of any BIY TV's on the market? Kit cars are wildly popular and currently I would not build my own as I lack: 1. The tools and workspace necessary to build one 2. The expertise necessary to build a car as they aren't exaclty like LEGOs or pre-assembled computer parts that fit simply into defined areas in a case or on a motherboard 3. The desire to do so But you better believe that if I did have those 3 items I'd be building that 427 Cobra Oh and safety is a concern. If your BIY computer fails what happens? You're buying new parts or saying "f*ck it" and going to Best Buy and grabbing an OEM one, should you not have the qualifications I list earlier. If your BIY car fails, you're possibly dead or causing significant bodily or property damage as a result. That's a little different than assembling a simple computer.
I have stated that before, and should emphasize it once again. Building It Yourself will most likely cost more. There is no doubt about it. It is the "economy of scale" principle. Building your own car from parts would most likely cost more than buying a ready-made model from the manufacturer. The reason for BIY is not for saving money. Because even if the parts cost the same, the amount of time spent in building one would make it not worth doing. The reason for BIY would be more for fulfilling a need that is not satisfied by the models available in the market. For me that is my need for having more than 3 available PCI/PCIe slots and a faster processor. Do I need a 1.5TB disk? No. I don't "need" it. It was on sale. For only $20 more than a 750GB disk. Why not? I can turn this PC into a home file server or a backup vault. I can also use the disk space to sort out my digital photos after work. More disk space is alway better than less. Note that your Dell computer, though sold at $671, has a Celeron Core 2 Duo E7600 chip. Ranking is 2113. http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu_list.php Mine is a i7 930 2.80GHz, ranking is 5858 As I said, prices vary a bit depending on the processor used and the amount of memory. Same goes for the PCs sold in stores. There are roughly 3 classes: - Low end, around $400 to $500 - Mid end, around $700 to $900 - High end, around $1000 to $1300
Oh, come on TraderZones. This is very different from building your own car. Building your own car requires special tools (a garage, wrenches, engine haul, jacks, etc..). TV? It will cost you more just to buy the plasma glass than the whole TV. But it is really not that hard to put a PC together from components. There are only about 7 to 8 hardware pieces. Physically mount them - takes a screw driver and perhaps a pair of pliers. The rest is wire connection. Most of the wires use different receptacles for different things (e.g. power wires versus SATA versus IDE versus USB, etc..). Hooking up wrong wires to the wrong socket is unlikely. And one should follow the user guide from the motherboard. There are schematic diagrams in there. Most of the functions of a PC is provided in the motherboard. The rest is really just to plug in the processor chip, the memory clips, the peripherals (hard disk, DVDRW drive, etc.). How hard can this be? If you can write a C++ program to do your automated trading strategies, you can do this! As for warranty... yeah, yeah. That's why stores like Fry's make so much money off the "extended" warranty. They are taking money from 95% of the purchases to pay for those cases lying outside the 2 sigma bands. I used to be a DIY guy but as I grow older I don't bother with a lot of those. (I used to build my sunroom and balcony in my backyard from a kit and lumbers from Home Depot.) Now I just do what is necessary for my business.
Currently I put XP Home SP3 on the box. TradeStation 8.7 runs just fine. I am getting Windows 7 64-bit.
http://www.compusa.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=5999284&CatId=4928 Can this be built cheaper than the price quoted? Thanks.
You listed your points very well Bryan. I think Dells are good boxes. I had used some in my last company but I have never owned one personally. I have some HPs and e-Machines. HPs are nice (the desktop) and I like them. But I bought a lemon HP laptop. Manufacturers locking down on everything is annoying to me. That is how IBM does business. You never touch an IBM anything you void your service contract. They will send a technician (probably in a black 3-piece suit) to come to your business with X hour to change a LED. But of course you need to pay them in tens of thousands a year for such a privilege. I think it should be better for consumers to have open systems. In fact that's how the OEM computer companies (remember Eagle, Packard Bell, etc.) bloomed like mushrooms in the mid 80's. But the industry had a shake out and now we end up with only a few makes. The milk cow Gateway is hard to be seen these days. HP swallowed Compaq who swallowed DEC who beaten up Data General. HP's original PC line of Vectra really sucked and it's the Compaq PC lines that helped them. Anyway... I had gotten too far. The Boli Trading Computer brand is on the rise. ;-)
Ok, I can see you guys think building your own is a piece of cake, but it's still not something I feel comfortable with. What I'd like to know, if anyone could help, is whether you think it's better to go to a dell or a small computer shop in the area. I realize the small guy could go out of business, but what are the other considerations?
At $4691, I would say probably. You need to do some homework yourself to figure it out. I give you a base line: Mine was about $1200. The processor: their i7 980, about $700 higher than my i7 930 The DVD: they use a bluray, may be $200 more Windows-7: add $200 Memory: 12GB just the same Graphic card: I am not familiar with what they use. Figure out a high end gaming graphics card is about $200 to $300 Disk drive: 1.5TB - about the same Solid State Drive: That's something I am totally unfamiliar with. They provide 2 SSD 64GB each. So the SSD is what you need to look more into.