I have to disagree with this statement. As an end user of Echotrade, a remote trader, I have noticed absolutely no difference since Pax Clearing became affiliated with Merrill Lynch. I still deal with the same people I always have. There have been no changes in rates, no new fees, no new rules. Just a couple of weeks ago, Rob Keller had Gabrielle contact me to get my fax number, so he could send me an article of interest. I don't even know Rob! (but have spoken to him a few times). That is VIP-type service for a non-VIP who has a small account and monthly volume that would not impress anyone. I'm sure Don has information about corporate business that would never reach me here in the cornfields of the midwest, but all that really matters to a trader, a customer, is the cost and the quality of the service they are getting. I would bet that you can't go wrong with either company. Good luck to all, Tom
Hello everyone, I am currently at Echo and I was with Bright for a few years. I am actually thinking of going back to Bright, simply because they have the capital structure that is needed both intraday and overnight. Echo does offer positives that Bright doesnt offer now.. One having the ability to trade options in your account they also have pairs programs and the abiility to automate your trading model right into the current platform With their predator pro system. Bright never offered me the competetive rates Echo has even when I was trading larger amounts. My fees were literally half, but the downside to that is the lack of anythign larger than 5-1 overnight for positions or 10-1 hedged for pairs Bright does offer the capital and offers alot of it overnight to be able to trade pairs. Though more times than not that has gotten me into trouble. If you only have 20-30k to trade with Bright is the way to go. If you have 100k+ to start with then definately go with Echo trade. That being said I am thinking of going back to Bright only because I dont like keeping alot of money in the account since I get into trouble that way and they still allow very good leverage and a solid platform although not as diverse as EchoPro. Bob has been cool with me even though I was a pain in the butt sometimes. I did something I wasnt suppose to and they ddint kill me, but Echo guys have been nice to me too. Its really more of leverage or no leverage. If you need good leverage Bright has Echo and if you have the cash but need a really snappy platform go with Echo. I was also mislead by Rob because when I talked to him intially on the phone he said they allowed 10-20:1 trading but didnt mentioned that it had to be 5:1 overnight. Though I have been profitable the last three months there I have to admit I have had times I missed the ability to hold positions I wasnt able to hold at Echo Trade. Thats hurt my pairs trading style alot. Don and Bob know me and So do Ed and the boys at Echo. I have nothing to hide just being honest. My track record hasnt been great I have been learning in this business much like most guys. If you guys want more info feel free to ask me via instant messenger or email Ciao Steve M
Running a business comes down to managing your margins. Trading is no different. You're biggest cost in this business is commissions, especially if you are trading some volume. Yes, Bright will give you all the money you want to trade, but it comes at a price, a very steep price. When you factor in the increased commission costs, combined with haircut which is not based upon risk but based upon capital, you will not come out ahead. Be honest with yourself and your true edge, I doubt you will be able to overcome the "house" edge and make more money at Bright. Good luck! P.S. I do agree that if you are a low capital trader you are probably better off at Bright because they will let you play the lottery, and you might get lucky.
As Mike knows very well, our "edge" is that we are still here, we have excellent traders (making excellent money), and that we have the capital and the understanding of trading to help our traders. And, some day, I predict, even Mr. Schey will see the "light" and will return, as have so many. Again, our "edge" is survival, and we cannot survive without successful traders who can admit that the bottom line is more important than the temporary (possibly) cheaper gas price. All the best to Mike and crew..... Don
Don, I want to come back to Bright and will once you offer a good deal on futures. I can not scale by high frequency trading with just equity. What is your time line on futures? Looking forward to that day! TC
Bright is a tradeoff, they give you enough rope to hang yourself with the leverage, but the haircut they charge is asinine on overnights. They still charge desk fees with uncometitive rates....but argue that since they have "been around" that it is legitimate to make more off their traders than other firms do.... I think people would be a lot happier with Bright if you just revised the cost structure a little. It is a solid firm with some merits, but trying to charge excessive fees is not cool. The daytrading industry is moving to very low margins, while Bright still insists on charging high ones.....
i am a prop trader in nyc, but have a serious itch to get back home to chicago...after looking hard for trading firms, seems like the only two firms out there that trade stocks (commodities are king i guess) are bright and echo. i'm leaning towards echo, and want to know if anybody out there has some solid information on their software, rates and payout. i trade about 75 million shares a year with gross P/L of about 700K, so im not making huge chops per trade but putting up pretty good numbers with a special kind of scalping style. obviously the ticket costs can't be too high for my style of trading. also, does anybody know if echo has direct access to all ecns (arca, isld, brut, btrd and size) and whether the software is customizable to enter mutiple orders on them? and how hard would it be to get 750K bp from them? sorry for all the questions but i would appreciate any help. thanks.
i don't like to be negaitve but your note seems very fishey. here you are saying you make $700k a year trading 400k shares a day and yet you're a prop guy making less than 100% and looking for 750k bp. makes no sense at all. if you made that kind of money you could put 200k down and make100% of payout and pay .002 or so with that type vol.