business success is hard enough without a cartel writing negative articles while at the same time shorting that company's stock illegally with an unlimited amount of counterfeit certificates. they push the price down, the media throws out some negative articles and now a company that was showing progress has its borrowing cost increased. maybe vendors pull out... or offer much less favorable terms. you're sad argument of "the company will ultimately win out, if the fundamentals are sound" is at best pitifully naive. families lose their jobs, investors lose their savings and you want to argue fundamentals? here is the deal, your ego ran your mouth when you didn't know what you were talking about and now your ego is forcing you to continue a loser's argument.
I know very little about stock manipulation (I am futures trader). Can someone enlighten me, what is the purpose of naked shorting being allowed? Until this thread I did not even know that such practice exists. How these guys pick which companies to can do it at? It does not happen to any major IPOed firms. I do not think anyone was naked shorting Google. Thanks, redduke
Cry me a river. Here is the deal: you and flytiger talk the same party line and neither can answer my question. You deflect attention from what I am saying and you resort to insulting me when everything else fails.
The king was Amir Elgindy. Much of his court stuff is sealed, but he bribed Jeffery Royer and Lynn Wingate. Royer was the Head of Oklahoma FBI office, wingate was his assistant. Elgindy had a tiered system that disseminated information to subscribers at different levels. They would use Royer to get FBI files on CEO's, etc, and then work backwards. They would, after getting short, bribe officials, press, even agencies, after they were short. Actually, Elgindy would pump his own stuff before the "Inside Truth", his internet newsletter would come out and crush the stock. He and his pals were long ont he pump, short on the dump. In testimony at his hearing, an accomplice, Derrick Cleveland, said, when he couldn't get the job done in the US, Canada would allow them to naked short about anything. Since Elgindy, his network lives over on Silicon Investor. Truthseeker is Floyd Schneider, who was Elgindy's research guy. He denies every working for Elgindy, buy Elgindy publically fired him. Go figure. Since Elgindy, Naked Shorting has become an art form. At 82, NYX announced a secondary, magically hit the sho list, and plummetted to the low sixties, where the perps obviously covered with new stock, an illegal move. PIPES have been missused to the point of insanity in much the same way. Hilary Shane, a hedgie, and FBR were nailed on Compuserve. Shane is now under criminal prosecution, which is scaring the hell out of these morons. The game continues as Wall St. Regulators, captured by the Street, fine these knuckleheads a mill after they make 100 mill. It has evolved from NSS to all sorts of RICO acts; you're seeing hacking from Eastern Europe, Money Laundering, all the same players over and over, and nobody does anythng. They will, and this time, we're going back and finger pointing to who knew what when. Should be fun. I will point out that Elgindy was looking at 25 years to life, got a bit over 11. Wingate was put on probation. Matsumoto, the producer of the Bloomberg piece who was at the hearing, and I had a discussion. He said she didnt' know anything. That's why she didn't go to jail. I've talked to Feds,a nd they say there is no probation for Federal Crimes. She squealed. You certainly couldn't expect the Judge to say, "well, you gave up all your friends, so you can go." She'd be dead in a week. If you're rolling people like this, you can expect action down the road. As to the companies they pick. Byrne said he was selected because he went with the Dutch Auction. He got some middle of the night calls with threats they'd destroy him. He's never said as much, but I'm sure his life has been threatened. Orrin Hatch told him that if one hair on his head was touched, Hatch would bring the world down on these guys. Another target with Elgindy was any company or CEO or exec where he could find a wart. then, he'd have the FBI file. He'd tip the SEC to go investigate. I think even Nutjob could make money if he knew the SEC would investigate. Reference TASR. I's sell my soul to get the tipper. Another way was any PIPE. Sedona was a case, but there were thousands. If you can drag a listed company to the OTCBB, it is as easy as pie to destroy it. You dry up capital, no one wants to do business because of the condition of the stock, etc. Then you get discounted stock, and more and more the lower it goes. They don't even replace it many times, because it's in the cards.......zero. Purpose being allowed? Trillions of dollars. That simple.Watch the DEC 5 Aguirre hearings at the Senate Judiciary Committee. Spector, Chairman of that time, questions Paul Berger, Aguirre's immediate supervisor, who magically went to a high powered law firm. Spector accuses him, as well as others. "Your testimony does not jive with your written statements." So, this guy is being accused of perjury, but he's making high six figures. Ask yourself, why go to the SEC for your "talent". Why not go to Brown, Harvard, Yale????? There is a long history of Wall St. hiring in this fashion. And it does happen on IPOS. Vonage was a case. I heard the reason was the CEO, who was the original SOES bandit. You don't cross Wall St. ...Period. Watch the SHO lists. Very interesting.. These morons will tell you they are all shit companies, but CROX, GROW, MSO, TASR, NYX, NMX and many more are on, or have frequented the list. Hope that helps. It's just a thumbnail, though. Very complicated, because that's the way it was designed.
Hi Flytiger, Thanks for this info. I can understand that a lot of money is being made with this technique, but I still wonder why government would not make it illegal. After all, there are a lot of other things that can make tons of money but they are illegal. Another reason why I like to trade futures, is that they are so strait forward, and the games played there do not even come close to what is being done in the stocks. Regards, redduke
don't be so sure. Go look at the thread I started in Wall St. News on SEC allows Insider trading if you disclose it.
Using basic economic theory, if there is infinite supply, then the correct price is zero. The only reason that there is infinite supply is that the thieves are gaming the system and the regulators are looking the other way.
Infinite supply is an exaggeration, don't you think? Another point I'd like to throw out there is that for some of these companies, the correct price for them is probably $0.
its not like they are actually printing the fake certificates... they dont have to. the DTCC is looking the other way while the "SEC is seeing no evil." they can just keep hitting that little sell button all they want to. no one cares and people like you don't understand the dynamic.