Bitcoin Price Thread

Discussion in 'Crypto Assets' started by Magna, Nov 26, 2017.

  1. NoahA

    NoahA

    Yes... exactly this!

    Its funny because when you really lay out the idea of money, the properties that money needs to have, and what we have tried before and why it failed, the reasons behind Bitcoin really do make sense. And then when you pile on top of this the drawbacks to fiat money, then Bitcoin makes even more sense.

    I honestly cannot come up with a logical argument against Bitcoin. Even if you don't like Bitcoin, the fiat system to an intelligent person has to raise eyebrows. So if you can understand that fiat is broken, and then look to a solution, you will literally list all the properties that Bitcoin already has. Its funny to watch financial podcasts where they discuss how many parts of the economy or financial system are broken, and they can so accurately describe what is needed to fix the system, and not make the connection that Bitcoin already does all of this.

    Lets say you don't like the energy use and think it should take very little power to run the network. Ok, so then what you want is for the anyone to have the ability to take the network down. Its like limiting password for any online account to 3 characters and then wondering what everyone is always hacked!

    Let's also not forget how much energy goes into the fiat system. Its not just a bunch of paper and printers to produce the bills. Its all the useless Fed officials. They have what is it, 1200 PhD's on their payroll? How much energy do they all consume? Then on course you need an entire task-force to worry about counterfit bills, which I'm sure has an entire arm of the FBI. How about all the security needed when these Brinks trucks drive around picking up and delivering cash? How about all the ATM's necessary? And the biggest of all, how about the entire US military invading god knows how many countries simply to keep everyone on the US dollar standard? Add this all up to get an accurate picture of the energy needed for the US dollar system and then compare this to the energy use for the Bitcoin network.

    This exercise can of course be completed for every piece of negative bias against Bitcoin. Those who hate Bitcoin simply do not understand it enough, or they benefit too much from the current system so don't want it to change.
     
    #6051     Sep 8, 2024
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  2. SunTrader

    SunTrader

    It costs $0.03+ to make a new penny. Think about that?

    (MORNINGBREW)


    NEWS ANALYSIS


    Is the penny obsolete?
    [​IMG]
    Max Zolotukhin/Getty Images

    The penny is like an ashtray in an airplane bathroom—a holdover that no one has the energy to nix.

    That’s the thesis of Caity Weaver’s 7,000-word manifesto published in New York Times Magazine last weekend, in which she argues that the US needs to consign the measly tokens to the dustbin of numismatic history. She decided to offer her two cents on the matter after learning that producing a single penny costs the US Treasury more than three pennies.

    • The government lost over $94 million last year minting billions of the pesky discs, which are used mostly as change for cash purchases ending with .99 and…not much else.
    • The vast majority are destined to vanish into couch crevices and other places of coin oblivion, abandoned by Americans who have no reason to carry currency with a face value that amounts to a rounding error after centuries of inflation.
    Weaver is far from the first commentator to find the status quo absurd: She joins a chorus of penny abolitionists that includes prominent economists, US Mint officials, lawmakers, and at least one POTUS (Obama). But despite years of grumbling about the superfluousness of the near-worthless coins and several congressional bills to ditch them, nothing has yet killed the penny once and for all.

    Who’s grasping at pennies?
    “A penny saved is a penny earned” rings true for the Tennessee metal manufacturer Artazn, the government’s sole supplier of the zinc blanks used to make the 1-cent coins (a penny is made up of 98% zinc coated with copper). The company, which was bought by private equity in 2019, has raked in $1 billion in revenue since 2008 from selling zinc discs to the US Mint.

    Artazn’s lobbying on Capitol Hill is the main reason for the penny’s endurance, according to retired US Mint Spokesperson Tom Jurkowsky and other sources Weaver spoke to. Though the company spent a relatively paltry $3 million on coin lobbying efforts, Artazn is the loudest voice promoting pro-penny talking points, sponsoring the advocacy group Americans For Common Cents, which argues:

    • The abolition of the penny would negatively impact low-income people and the unbanked, who make up a disproportionate amount of cash users, by causing stores to round up prices.
    • Charities like the Leukemia & Lymphoma Society rely on penny donations for fundraising.
    • Polls show that the majority of Americans want to keep the penny.
    But many penny opponents claim that these arguments don’t add up to much, just like a bucket of pennies.

    Down with the penny
    Penny abolitionists point out that cash usage is declining and highlight studies showing that even cash-loving consumers would not be harmed if prices were rounded to the nearest nickel. Just like some after-tax totals would be rounded up by one or two cents, others would be rounded down (one study did predict a minuscule price increase in aggregate).

    Plus, the US wouldn’t be the first country to ditch the penny:

    • Canadian merchants say that consumers there have gotten used to the rounding system the country implemented when it stopped minting its one-cent coin in 2013.
    • The US itself previously parted ways with the half-cent coin at a time when it was worth more than today’s penny.
    Concerns for charities might also be misplaced. When Weaver reached out to the Leukemia & Lymphoma Society, she was told that the organization no longer relies on coin drives and has been more successfully using credit card payment roundups to fundraise.

    As for the penny’s supposed popularity, the majority of Americans across party lines are on board with ceasing penny production once they’re told how much it costs to make them, according to a 2022 poll by progressive think tank Data for Progress.

    There are some Abe Lincoln stans who worry that the demise of the penny would diminish the legacy of the 16th president, whose profile graces its obverse. Financial Times reporter Sam Learner proposes erecting a copper-plated Lincoln monument made out of melted pennies to appease them.

    So, why are shiny new pennies still a thing? Weaver blames government inertia. The Fed reflexively orders them from the Treasury, the Treasury fulfills the order from the Mint, and Congress lacks the political urgency to officially nix them. But she claims there’s one person with the power to pull the penny kill switch: According to an obscure law Weaver discovered during her research, the Treasury Secretary can simply not order any coins she deems unnecessary.—SK
     
    #6052     Sep 8, 2024
  3. orbit23

    orbit23

    OK, let's assume that Bitcoin is the greatest invention the world has ever seen.

    Gold is a store of value. It has a long trading history; thousands of years, whereas Bitcoin has only existed for 16 years.

    It's still a risk-on asset. It crashes the hardest amidst the uncertainty, like it did during Covid.

    The stocks are overbought. The elections are coming. There will be some shake-out type of an event rather sooner than later.
    And when it happens, Bitcoin will bleed harder than anything, i can promise you that.


    Be smart. Sell when price is high and you can stack more coins and buy the lows. If you don't sell the highs, you might end up panic selling the lows.

    At this point you should be praying with all your might and will several times a day for an exit pump here.

    Honestly it's not looking the best, but there is a chance. Tether is still alive. They might print some fake Tether dollars in attempt to pump the price up.

    There is some big event token2049 Singapore coming up on 18th of september, also the rate cuts, full moon and end of summer.

    I don't know that there will be, but if there is an exit pump on such confluence you sell everything and never look back.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2024
    #6053     Sep 8, 2024
  4. Thanks Captain Obvious. But as the world's best performing asset, it HAS TO BE a risk-on-asset. Otherwise, it would be a violation of Basic Investing 101.

    Thanks again Captain Obvious. But I do believe the market already knows this.
     
    #6054     Sep 8, 2024
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  5. orbit23

    orbit23

    It would have crashed even if it was the greatest tech the world has ever seen.

    Unfortunately though it's shitty technology / scam propped up by fake Tether dollars.


    $52B of assets under management from all bitcoin ETFs combined.

    Can anyone guess how many Tethers have been printed since 2022 bottom?

    Let me break it to you, about exactly $52 billion!


    Tether has to print fake money to prop up the market to attract new capital, so that the ponzi scheme doesn't collapse. Luckily for Bitcoiners, they managed to find a new victim to latch onto; insitutional investors through ETFs.


    Even Peter Thiel himself said it "we've got the ETFs, i don't know who else is there left to buy".

    The final stage before the collapse. But ponzis tend to collapse at the end of the cycle as people start to cash out, only to realize - there is no money!
     
    #6055     Sep 9, 2024
  6. Ohh, I see. And how well did that advice work out for gold bears after the ETFs came out and there was 'no one else left to buy".

    Oh wait! Gold has been on a rip to the upside ever since... Doh!


    But thanks again for the philosophy. I'm going to tell my local grocery store, that now they are already selling to the masses, "I don't know who else is there left to buy".

    In the meantime, I do pray there is a mass plunge to the downside and you are vindicated. Hopefully the AI bubble bursts at the open today and puts us there. Definitely would be happy to see triple-digit Ethereum one more time... just... one more chance!
     
    #6056     Sep 9, 2024
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  7. Ed48

    Ed48

    Not true.

    Gold ETFs were launched in the latter stages of the Gold bull market which started in 2000.
    Gold peaked in 2011, and then entered a multi-year bear market.
    Anyone who bought Gold ETFs would have got a very poor return over the next decade.

    The Gold bull market only resumed about 4 years ago.

    Unfortunately, if history is anything to go by, ETFs typically start appearing near the top of the cycle. Of course, this time may be different. :D
     
    #6057     Sep 9, 2024
  8. SunTrader

    SunTrader

    (BLOOMBERG)

    Bitcoin outflows
    US Bitcoin exchange-traded funds have posted their longest run of daily net outflows since listing at the start of the year. Investors pulled close to $1.2 billion in total from the group of 12 ETFs over the eight days through Sept. 6, data compiled by Bloomberg show. That said, Bitcoin rallied along with other risk assets on Monday, though its year-t0-date gains have cooled to about 30%. The token will likely trade in its recent $53,000-to-$57,000 range until US inflation data on Wednesday, said Caroline Mauron, co-founder of Orbit Markets.
     
    #6058     Sep 9, 2024
  9. orbit23

    orbit23

    Gold was created by supernovas billions of years ago. What did it take to create Bitcoin? A single ponzi anonymous fucker, who premined 5% of the entire supply.

    And on top of that now the majority of Bitcoin volume is done against fugazi Tether dollar ran by an offshore company that has never been audited, is operated by people with criminal and fraudulent past who on top of that have been caught lying multiple times about Tethers backing and solvency.


    Doesn't sound like a scam at all.
    Sounds like a great investment to onboard entire family into.
     
    #6059     Sep 9, 2024
  10. johnarb

    johnarb

    Bitcoin is the best money in the history of the world
     
    #6060     Sep 9, 2024
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