best prop firm to short stocks?

Discussion in 'Prop Firms' started by optionzztrader, Jun 8, 2007.

  1. meaning, which prop firm with integrity allows you to short pretty much any stock that is marginable without any trouble? i love to short stocks and do not want to be limited to just buying equities. thanks.

  2. I'll be honest with you...."with integrity"....
    I don't think it's possible.
    I was with a Prop firm and we got almost <any> shorts within 30 minutes. However, I don't believe they were "following the rules" regarding offsetting capitalization and risk.
    Of course, when I tried to leave this prop firm, it took almost 6 weeks of "fighting" to get my funds.
    Ask Don Bright who heads a "credible" prop firm "with integrity".
    He might say "days". It will take several "days" to get the borrowed stock to short.
    Bottomline: You better get the funds to become an exchange member if you want this "privilege".
  3. We clear with Goldman, who undoubtedly has the best short stock pool. It's just a matter of who you clear with.

  4. EricP



    How many stocks are on your short list?

  5. cstfx


    Look for anyone who uses Genesis and their Laser platform. They have access to the short list from 3 different liquidity providers, among them Merrill Lynch. While it may not be as extensive as GS (GS is the 800 lb gorilla) it is still rather impressive and changes daily.
  6. Oh, I have no idea...I figure that if Goldman can't short it, who can?

  7. EricP


    I have no idea either. But, since you suggest that they have "undoubtably the best short list", then you would increase your credibility with such a statement by backing it up with the number of shortable stocks. Without that, you are just making unsubstantiated claims, IMO.

    FWIW, I see that Genesis has 8018 stocks on their short list as of yesterday, per the list posted by cstfx.
  8. cstfx


    That number is kinda low for Genesis. It is usually one or two grand higher daily. Maybe short lists shrink going into the weekend?

    As to GS, they are a market maker in just about every stock, so you have to believe that their numbers are greater than that already mentioned. You can pick on Bright all you want, and after reading a few of your posts, you do, but you can't deny the book that this country's largest trading company has at its disposal.
  9. I'll get a number if you want...I guess someone at Goldman can tell me.

    Can you tell me what the 8000 or so from "G" is "out of how many possible" - that would make the search easier.

  10. EricP


    I started with a simple question, asking how many shortable stocks they offered. I don't dispute that they do (or don't) have the most. I simply don't know. However, the way to determine which firm has the best short list (which is the topic of this thread), the participants can merely compare how many shortable stocks are available at the various firms. Simply asserting "my firm is best" with no supporting information really doesn't help the answer the OP's question, IMO.

    In terms of 'picking' on Don... To tell you the truth, I like Don and think that he is an asset to the trading industry. That said, I think he has a tendency to put a little extra 'spin' on his 'facts' too frequently for my tastes. I don't blame him for this, as he represents a major firm in this industry and wants to advertise on this site, and has paid for such advertising.

    On the other hand, I am an independent trader who has no vested interest in any of the firms mentioned on ET. I am a straight shooter, and try to provide honest information to those with questions on this site. As such, I sometimes feel compelled to ask Don questions, or reply to his criticisms of my posts on ET. I certainly have no hard feelings towards Don, however.

    FWIW, I went to the RML Trading website, and found their short list at:

    If I'm not mistaken, they still clear through Penson. From the link, their short list appears to have 5057 stocks.
    #10     Jun 9, 2007