you are not reading what i said. i keep a minimum of around 4k and a maximum of 10k in my FUTURES account. i have 4 accounts (not including my IRA) 1)futures (for income) (never more than 10k in account) 2)longterm (dividends for income and also for capital appreciation) 3)swing stocks and options (for income and hedging) 4)and another futures account, purely for position trading (i will also do spread trading of futures in this account, covered calls on futures, etc.) this provides a very comfortable living AND some nice capital appreciation. heck, ONE trade or investment can make your month. RNAI doubling happened to make mine! i must admit it was not my initial call, i got it rec'd from a trader i often converse with, did the DD, and got a nice double. with just over 4k, depending on your broker, you can trade 2-3 contracts. i trade from 2-5 contracts. i take the PROFITS and filter them into longterm investments and many of those provide great income as well. have you ever heard of DIVIDENDS? the point is that i do NOT let my futures account grow. i purposely purge it so as to keep my mind straight, that this is an income producing thing, not a "get rich quick thing" since i don't want to trade more than 5 contracts, there is no reason to have a big futures account. the vast majority of my setups have less than a 12 pt stop (many are 8 and 10.) 10 pts with 4 contracts is $200 loss max . so, even if i get three losing trades and no winners (hasn't happened yet, but n=/=enough for that apparently), that would be a $600 drawdown. that would SUCK in a 7 or 8 k account, but this is futures trading. it's highly leveraged. i never let my account get over 10k ... EVER. with futures leverage, you do not need more (for 2-5 contracts) and that would only tempt me to trade larger size. i can't do that for at least another 1k trades, based on my rules. rules are everything in trading - discipline. this is one of the way i manage risk. i purposely keep my trading account small. i have purchased a LOT of very nice dividend producing stocks, all with futures income profits. those provide a very consistent income stream. you do it your way, i'll do it my way. i would NEVER recommend a beginner trade more than 1 contract per 10k. i also recommend beginners trade DIA (instead of YM) for at LEAST 6 months. it's a way to get "real trading" in (not paper trading) while only risking 1 dollar per point per 100 shares. that allows some nice scaling to approximate multiple contracts (like 300 shares with targets for the first 100 and 200) and basically offers a "mini of a mini" to practice on. also, if u can trade DIA successfully, you can definitely trade YM successfully, since YM offers superior fills . since i KNOW this works, you can't tell me it doesn't. most traders lose money. so, listening to "most traders" might not be the best advice
I've read what you said. It looks like you've found what you need to do to be profitable. best of luck. Banking money and keeping accounts seperate probably helps you function in a more disciplined manner. I just think 5k for a trading account would make trading much more stressful than it needs to be. And futures trading doesn't need to be leveraged - that is my point. You say $10k/1 contract could work. I say $30-60k/1 contract might be more appropriate (unlevered). BTW, 10 pts on DJIA is nothing. Thats a very tight stop. Different trading style entirely. Also... I'm in the same camp with you on nice income producing securities, ie VGR, PGH, NAT, AAV, etc. etc. Nice opportunities this week on the canadian oil/natgas trust front.
10 pts is not a big stop. but again, in my 1st account, it's scalping a position trade might have a 100 pt or 200 pt stop even i don't stress on the money. i just concentrate on the setups any trade with larger than a 12 pt stop or so would go on in my position trading account, not my futures income account. this is nice too because i could be long YM in the position account, but go long and short numerous times in the income account. different time frames, methodologies and goals
USE your emotions. What peek into the future do they give you ? What do they tell you about your present position ? ( cash,long,short) Set up a monitoring routine and log your emotions, your subsequent actions and the markets outcome vs your position. Some possible observations: Observation: You get giddy at the prospect of how much you will make based upon how fast how high/low the mkt has advanced in "your" direction. Subsequent action: You buy more. Outcome: That was the top and a great exit point. How to use: Next time you have a position making you giddy consider taking your profit. Observation: You are bored. The mkt is going nowhere. Subsequent action: You quit watching that mkt and start looking for something hotter. Outcome. The boring mkt has a strong breakout which you missed by looking away at other mkts. How to use: Next time you are bored set up an alert or stops to trigger your entry into a breakout. Your emotions give you information. USE IT.
I have become emotionless since i started trading about 6 weeks ago. I really feel like a trader now. i've made seven trades now, and well into the swing of it all, buying and selling. ive got 4 trades right and 3 wrong. if it wasnt for becomming emotionless after 2 weeks, i would never have made it this far. good trading all.
yeah, wait 'till u up your size and bump into serious losses then tell me how 'kewl'n'composed' u fell."
The larger size you trade, the harder it is to become emotionless. Just work your way up to larger and larger positions until it feels "normal". cm69
Hi guys. How long will it be before i'm feeling normal? i cant wait to be a normal tader. I've got rid of emotion, now i just want the hard cash. there must be some way of cutting all the corners, like say a magic system. good trading all.