At last a plan that gets at the root cause of the crisis...

Discussion in 'Wall St. News' started by Mvic, Oct 30, 2008.

  1. gnome


    You KNOW that's not how it works.... the responsible are called upon to foot the bill for all of the non-responsible..
    #11     Oct 30, 2008
  2. Mvic


    Yes, it will end up being at least double that. A stitch in time. Imagine where we would be if $100B had been applied to the sub prime issue back in the fall of 2007, in terms of modifying the term or rate of all but the hopeless cases. The irony is that in the end Bernanke and paulson will likely be lauded for having brought us back from the brink when they were instrumental in TAKING us to the brink in the 1st place with their cool calm and unruffled act.
    #12     Oct 30, 2008
  3. gnome


    I hear this statement all the time, but I don't see it. (Sort of a mythical "battle cry" of certain non-wealthy citizens.... no real truth to it, just sounds good to some.) I don't recognize any money flowing my way, I just pay A LOT... for which I feel I receive little.

    Maybe I'm just dense. Please provide an example or two about how money flows from the non-wealthy to the wealthy.
    #13     Oct 30, 2008
  4. I think what the goy was talking about was the mcCain/Palin rally idiots who horrifyingly scream the right wing party lines, but don't have a pot to piss in themselves...

    1 example would be the wealth transfer that occured from 2002-2008 culminating in a massive bailout OF the rich by the poor. The cause? The inflation tax and stagnant wage growth of the median family. Notice how Marc Faber said recently that the recession that we are in, and that is going to get worse, will effect the HAVE's and not so much the HAVE NOT's...The HAVE NOT's have already been fucked...
    #14     Oct 30, 2008
  5. Bingo.

    As much as the simpletons would like to think that the wealthy would be content just to live their lives and leave the rest of us alone, 'tis not so. Those in money and power want more of both. And after they finish trying to rape eachother for wealth, there is only one place to go where they can find millions of media-whored people willing and able to pay the wealthy to control them.
    #15     Oct 30, 2008
  6. gnome


    I don't buy that about '02-'08... a relatively small number of people made obscene money... by hook and by crook... but there was not "wealth transfer" from non-wealthy to the wealthy.

    The wealthy's assets are harmed as much and more by the same inflation. It's just that the wealthy "still have more" after having lost... that's not a transfer from non-to-wealthy.

    As for this bailout... the wealthy are kicking in on that too... through the same inflationary loss of buying power of their money... and are paying much more than the nons. It won't have the same "basic cost of living" impact as on the nons, however.

    The real and obvious impact of the bailouts is that ALL Americans are getting hosed to reimburse a relatively few greedy, reckless and unscrupulous people.. now THAT'S unconscionable. !

    In all cases, the wealthy still end up with more, regardless of how much they've paid. (That's always been a good reason and motivation for each of us to try to become wealthy, isn't it?)

    Many non-wealthy like to claim, "the rich are rich because they get all the tax breaks and loopholes"... Well there are some specific, and dirty examples of that in the tax code but which impact a very small number of people... but "breaks" are generally not the reason the "rich get richer".

    The REAL reason is capital. The non-wealthy spend a high percentage of their income on their lifestyle so that there is little left to invest... which makes it difficult to accumulate capital.

    The wealthy's lifestyle usually consumes a smaller percentage of their income... leaving money left over for investment and capital accumulation... and then there is the fact that "capital begets capital"... through investment and even just compounding of interest. None of which is a transfer of money from the nons to the wealthy.

    The truth about "breaks for the rich".. is that they become wealthier IN SPITE OF BEING HOSED BY THE TAX CODE.... not a concept the nons are willing to embrace.

    And as America goes more and more Socialistic, whatever opportunity there was for an individual to become financially successful will be significantly reduced.
    #16     Oct 30, 2008
  7. Mvic


    #17     Oct 31, 2008

  8. When the currency is debased, not everyone is hurt equally. First, those that debase the currency benefit most, by being able to use the new money before its buying power has decreased. In general, the closer you are to the source of the debasement, the more you benefit; hence the rich being closer to the source, is one way that wealth is transferred.
    #18     Oct 31, 2008
  9. talk about seigniorage.
    #19     Oct 31, 2008
  10. poyayan


    There is only one lesson to be learned here.

    Before : Used to be if you lend someone money, you are on the hook if that person defaults.

    Now : If the taxpayer is on the hook when someone default, that means free market fail and regulation is needed. Aka, everyone is going to have a HARD DEBT ceiling now. No, but, if, excuse. If you don't have the income, you don't get the loan period. Poor smuck can't own a home. Well, tough!
    #20     Oct 31, 2008