Don, you may not believe me, but I have absolutely no interest in bashing either you or your firm. The only issue I'm taking serious offense at is when you're implying that the given stats that have applied as long as I can think do not somehow apply to your firms customers. As I said before, it's not all bad, every directional trader who ever made it was aware of those stats, and that in no way stopped them from doing their best and making it in the face of those odds, and, for those trading with their own equity at risk the personal financial downside is limited to the amount put up, meaning that it's overseeable, whereas the upside is open. So, that's really all I'm on about.
We can agree on most of what you're saying...Our firm has never "sugar coated" anything, quite the opposite (that is why we attract really dedicated people, who see this as a profession and a business). I thought Hitman's posts were average for new traders, and that what he posted was fine. You have to remember, he is just an employee of a company, and is not restricted by regulations (I know you hate hearing that, but we are very restricted)...(Hi Diane!!!)...Diane is my Compliance Officer, and she gets real mean if I venture across any lines of propriety. So good luck with your ventures, and I hope to meet you someday.
In all sincerity and with due respect for you and this forum, is there a problem in your mind that prevents you from posting statistics? The reason I ask, is that I am only here to learn, and it would be most beneficial to the rest of us. It would be benenficial in that we would be able to have realistic expectations on our own success. Not that I judge myself by others standards, but would be nice to know anyhow. Thank You
Except for Hitman's stats and the stats of his team, and perhaps the occasional "this 6-figure trader is down 25k this year" the rest of the stats Hitman dished out were all guestimates. In fact it was quite amusing to see his guestimates waiver from post-to-post.
Darn, now I'll really have to go plug out and hit the weekend, but just wanna say that most concerning stats has been said already, trading, at least the kind where you're exposed to directional market risk, is no different than starting a business venture: Many feel called but only few are chosen. That ain't no different if you're talking top tier banks, somebody whose been making a market for a decade and gets a chance to trade a prop slot is no better off than somebody from the street, top education and exposure to top traders or not. But again, the thing is, downside is limited, lose the prop slot or your equity, if you're private or institutional, in both cases upside isn't. And I tend to believe that if you really want something in life you can get it. Maybe not the first time, but eventually. Of course, only provided you really want it. Maybe you're just thinking that you want something whereas in reality you're looking for something totally different in life. Ed Seykota said that everybody gets what they want from life, if they realise that or if they don't because they are blocking themselves on a subconscious level which probably happens a lot more than one would expect. And I totally subscribe to that point of view. Have a great weekend !
TigerO, The best daytrader we ever had at Lieber & Weissman Sec., L.L.C. used to make Pizza's at his dads Pizza place in Brooklyn( he was also a computer programer). He turned 15k into 1.75 million in 1998 , trading an average size order of 200-1000 shares. Some of the worst traders we ever had used to trade at hedge funds or were stockbrokers. Food for thought. Gene Weissman Lieber & Weissman Sec., L.L.C. gweissman@stocktrade.net
The "approved" numbers are as follows (we are prohibited from displaying anything that appears like advertising, as it pertains to performance). After a 1 year learning curve (as in any business), about 70% of our traders are successful, after about 2 years 80%..about half never make it the first year (which is much better than for most businesses).. Don
doesn't prove anything.... given a large enough sample size, it is a mathematical fact that a monkey could type the text to the holy bible just by randomly hitting keys on a typewriter.