My gosh... what a reply. As much as you piss me off wrbtrader, given how much effort you put into your replies to me, I have to at least commend you for the work involved. Listen, I have caught up on some other posts too and I even see some suggest that Q3D is marketsurfer. If this is the case, then it is an unfortunate waste of time all around. But even without this issue, I have to say there is still this troubling feeling I have. So many of your posts have the flavor of what isn't possible, what can't be done, what ET isn't, what ET cannot provide, etc. Lately everyone bitches about all the problems at ET, and yet nobody is doing anything to fix it. If the self moderation would clear up all these problems, then I would love to see that because you're clearly just as fed up with my posts as I am with having to write them. But I still think they are valid given all the info posted here. I don't doubt that many people agree with you about me, and I don't deny that I don't have problems, but given where I'm at, and vocal about it, there are 10 times as many traders on here in the exact same boat, but without the fire to share their frustrations like me, and not always frustrations, but even legitimate concerns. What really gets me is that so many of your posts point to all these other sources of much better information out there, and yet, your extensive posting here at ET is almost an oxymoron because you're spending so much time posting at ET about how inappropriate ET is for trading discussions. If ET is so horrible, which it seems to be as of late, then you would figure everyone would leave and there would even be any replies like mine, or the one from the OP. You would think that ET would just implode, and yet, lately we have a flurry of activity, quite heated in fact. In fact, if you got your way, if the forum was exactly how you wanted, there would simply be nothing to talk about. I made this exact same post in my journal more than a year ago. When I was posting about how horribly I was doing, the classic replies were.. "do you have a trading plan". If not, get one before trading. If yes, did you follow it. If you didn't follow it, your problems are psychological, and if you did follow it and are still losing, you don't have an edge. So if you don't have an edge, go back to looking for an edge. Then when you find an edge, go back to step 1. Now is this wrong, of course not, but if this is how it was, there would be absolutely no reason for a journal forum. Every single person who starts a thread in this section should always be pointed to this simple flow chart. And since ET isn't about looking for an edge, since you're saying its not the place to actually look for trade triggers and such, then there would really be no point to ET in the first since all problems could be solved by the flow chart. This is even more true since you say ET isn't a fraternity, and since trading trading is also very individual. That is perhaps what I find the most frustrating thing about your posts. If we did exactly what you suggest, if this place was exactly set up the way you think it should be, there would be no need for any posts or any discussions. ET wouldn't exist because its clearly the worst place to talk about trading, and if anyone did actually come here for trading help, they would be referred to the flow chart as I describe above. The way you describe ET, its about everything but trading. Trading, at the simplest level, starts with an entry and an exit. Of course to figure out when, and where and how to enter is what makes it so difficult, but you can talk about about theory and psychology and everything else till the cows come home, but it all comes down to an entry. The fact that so many experts here cannot talk about this is troubling to me. Sure you have to have an idea of where its going and understand the big picture and all that jazz, but to take advantage of any of it, there must be an entry. Once the entry is made, this is now where all the fun and pain begins. Now I realize there will be a huge amount of traders out there who completely disagree with me, who say that the entry is the least of your concerns when it comes to trading, and yes, I've read about these ideas and I understand in some ways what they are saying. But I still think that the way to separate the men from the boys is if those guys who actually say that everything else is soooo important, with the entry being the least important, then they could back this up. There was a question here way back when about indicators that people found most useful. Redneck had the best reply. His reply was that his PnL was his most important indicator. (I hope I got this quote right... its how I remember it.) Likewise, I think to summarize what I'm trying to capture with all my rants, and I think what all the strugglers out there would like to see is, does all the important mumbo jumbo, all the theories discussed to no end, all arguments about TA, everything on this forum, does it translate to a positive PnL. I don't give a shit if nobody wants to help me or if all they ever did was put me down, but I would respect them if I knew that they knew what they were talking about since their actions and views about the market translated to highly positive PnL's. Its like all these arguments about TA. Who gives a shit about how anyone views the market, the real question is if their view is making a profit. Since nobody can step up to the plate (as of late, since you say this used to be the case many yeas ago), everyone's opinion here only goes so far. This is why strugglers find it so hard on here I think. Its just a bunch of he said/she said. All wonderful arguments, sometimes not all that wonderful, but still, zero substance. (yes, I know I can also go to that Salon place to look up what PA traders are doing, but then this once again means there is no point in having ET around, which gets back to my earlier rant) Ps. Not that I actually think this, but since everyone says that marketsurfer is just looking for people to sign up for his trade call services business, couldn't we think of you as someone who is just looking to recruit for trading schools or perhaps trade competitions? Once again, I don't actually think this, but many of your posts talk about University level trading programs and trading competitions. You could perhaps know just as much about trading as marketsurfer. I could also be absolutely killing it right now but just posting on here under the disguise of a failed trader looking for kicks while I wait for price to hit my profit targets.
Lots have been done and Baron has made promises and its sad that he hasn't follow through on a promise to fix one of the biggest problems that members complain about...the troll problem. He did fix many other problems in the past via creating a section called Politics and Religion...it was better than nothing but it its not 100% and this forum has lost many good members because of such. ET does not contain resources I point to (e.g. specific info only mention in a professional magazine about the markets that can only be obtained via subscribing or buying a particular issue month). Therefore, it only makes sense to point others to those resources outside of ET after they solicited info about such. Simply, if someone said something like "Profitable PA traders don't exist and aren't able to prove such via live calls, brokerage statements or audits"...people like me would not point the doubters to resources outside of ET such as the Salon du Trading. Another example, if someone say to prove to him that institutional trading firms do not use TA...I"m going to point them to an outside resource that talks about using TA. Note: This forum doesn't contain every resource on this planet that involves trading. I'm astonish that you keep behaving like this whenever someone points to a resource elsewhere. Therefore, stick to the facts. Heck, you yourself agreed with me and concluded that forum is not a proper format for mentoring...that's really what this conversation is really about. I've given you an alternative way of getting your mentoring via you making the effort to join or setup a trading group in your own city area to meet other traders in person...developing your network to open up other possibilities that this forum can not do. Simply, I don't need what you need and you have not been around long enough to have similar needs as me. Regardless, many top members have left this forum primarily due to the lack of moderation while others have left due to other reasons that are personal or trading related. This forum has a well known troll problem and MANY members complain about such. I'm not the only one.[/quote] Once again, your interest mainly has involved trade methods. My interest is in topics you do not participate...things that I do talk about with specific details...things you obviously do not read or don't care about...most likely the latter. Not a big deal...everybody has different topics they are willing to talk about. Simply, if I got my way, this forum would be about the business aspects of trading, psychology, discipline, proper trading instruments, institutional trading, exchange regulations and many other topics I read in my subscription magazines. Yeah, such a place will not be suitable for you and you wouldn't be hanging out at ET because it would be more professional. You have not been here at the forum since its birth. Traders came here for reasons that aren't present today...reason why so many have left. Things change. Please be honest...you find it frustrating because I continuing calling you out when you start crap with me and you just don't like it. If Baron follow-through on his promise...I'm willing to bet more members will share...its as simple as that and nothing more. Therefore, please don't ignore the above and ignore there's been hundreds of discussions about such amongst many ET members that do not share because they feel this is an inadequate moderated environment...it has nothing to do with you. I never said such...do not imply such. I am clear and will say it again...this is not the proper format for mentoring and you already know how to go about getting mentoring. I never said its the worst place to talk about trading because if it was...I wouldn't be here. They don't need to. Traders that spent too much time tweaking their trade methods and not doing anything else with their trading plan have been honest enough here at this forum to discuss that they failed at the discipline stuff, failed at the psychology stuff, failed at the risk management stuff, failed at trading the proper trading instruments and so on. They admitted such about what should have been important in their trading. That's your proof. Obviously you do care because you keep complaining about people holding back info, not helping you, info not specific enough and so on as pointed out by many. If you truly didn't give a shit...its simple...stop talking about it and stop making accusations like you did in this thread in your initial post in this thread. Marketsurfer has been honest about his agenda here and was then banned appropriately for such. The fact that he was allowed to return and is still here implies he has not been marketing his fund or any other service again. In contrast, I gave a list of 75 different universities with trading rooms after someone solicited the information in a public message wanting to know if it was true that there are Universities teaching trading. My first reply was via naming MIT and I gave the guy the contact info at the University for finding out more info. Others chimed in and asked it there are others...I replied with a more complete list of Universities around the world. If you think I'm a recruiter for each of those universities or you think I'm a recruiter for specific institutional firms I've listed to be using TA or you think I'm here to force Baron to let us moderate our own threads...you really need to spend some time away from trading to regain your perspective about what you're trying to do especially if its a career as a retail trader. Which is it...I'm a recruiter for universities or I'm here to discourage traders from getting involved in trading. Seriously, you've hinted at both. I'm being a realist, some people are not suitable for trading and that is often decided prior to their first trade. They need others to tell them such because if only one person does it...its not believable. In fact, Baron wrote a nice message post indirectly about such involving writing intelligent messages to get an intelligent answers (replies) to prevent looking like someone that shouldn't be involved in trading. Regardless, some of these traders realize such on their own after hitting the retail trading thing for many years and still not able to pick that lock to profits. In contrast, some people are suitable for trading...they are obvious and should be encourage to continue...you can tell how they behave at this forum, types of questions they ask and resources they're using. Which one is you ? P.S. You working full-time somewhere or you a student or you're rich and can keep trying trading for many more years until your money runs out ?
Part of the problem is that nobody wants to trade behavior via a fast chart. I've shared a few charts in the past, 5 sec charts at key levels with nicely marked retracements or thrusts down that were quickly bought back up, but nobody replied. I've tried to also skype with other members here to discuss my methods and get their feedback and wasn't successful with this. You see, even though people keep claiming that I'm looking to be spoon fed, for quite a while now I have actually wanted help with what I was doing. Funnily enough, this is kind of what Q3D was getting at. Trading is just one small aspect of actually doing it profitably, so even though Brooks may have a book on trading, its unfortunate that you cannot read this book and learn to actually trade profitably. So I'm with you here about there needing to be a more complete picture. Ouch.. you don't think I take this professionally? Why do you think I am where I am? You can take the easy route and say I'm lazy or blind or what have you, but I got into my rut because of following too much on ET, too many tidbits of incomplete ideas. Its of course not the job of ET to look out for my well being, but when you start with ideas shared that profitable trading is easy, its not too hard to see how a person can fall to the way side quite easily. No.... I don't think so. I find it frustrating because none of you experts can put yourself into the shoes anymore of a new trader. Its like politicians. None of them actually understand what a poor person trying to make ends meet on a very limited budget while raising kids is going through. I can't say I know either as I don't have children and I am not on the poor end (hardly middle class, but still better off than many I think) Every time you guys criticize those who would like to see real trades, saying how someone else trades won't help anyone, I don't think you can intimately understand why this is important for the new trader. I won't even bother to defend my position because I'm fairly certain that you already think that watching a real trader place trades, trade after trade, would be of no value, and I feel that the opposite is true. Clearly my initial set of beliefs is not conducive to trading. But I know this can be changed, and I'm very well on my way. But I also feel that those people who belittle the importance of live calls, or shared statements, or at least an attempt to show trading profits circumvent the development of a proper trader's mindset. Case in point... when a someone only shares a few profitable trades, but never the losers, it doesn't help the new trader realize that bad trades happen and they shouldn't cause you to change a thing. I guess this is what just hit me. By seeing a trader trade, by seeing a chart with all trades marked, by following live calls and being aware of trades that work or don't and hence get stopped out, we could see the importance of the proper trader's mindset and the importance of following a series of trades. I agree that I won't learn how a person is trading, and nobody can ever trade exactly like anyone else, but there is great value in watching the process. Since trading is a process, accounting for good and bad, it would be nice to see this process at work.
You didn't know such when you first started trading but you know it now... Red flags when someone only talks about winners and don't mention anything about losers, states that trading is easy, states anyone can do it and so on. Simply, not your fault, you've develop a thirst to see it done in front of your own two eyes with full explanation when doing it. I get it...I understand that need. Just remember that they can not teach you how to trade. They can only teach you what they are doing. Then hopefully its enough info for you to develop your own style and teach yourself how to trade. Further, if you find someone in your area (I already detailed how I found my mentor)...you'll dramatically increase your chance of meeting a mentor and satisfying that thirst you have. There are several other ET members doing just that...they posted hook-up messages at different trading forums and setup a trading group in their city area. A few of which have found in person mentors that trade profitably.
Yes.. exactly.. this is exactly what I have been saying. Whenever someone tries to teach, they show you what they think is important based on what they think they are seeing. Who knows what is actually happening in their head and why. For every trade that actually sets up based on what ever trading plan they might write down, their subconscious mind may very well have a good reason to skip that trade. There is much I believe that isn't in a trading plan. In some ways, those who try to teach might actually do a better job by showing what they do. They try to guide you through a process of seeing, but this is dependant on the premise that what they say they are seeing and using for making decisions is in fact the whole story. Perhaps their mind is actually doing much more. Its like this. I could tell you all my lines for picking up girls and think that this is all that is necessary. But what I may be unaware of is how my eye movements, my body posture, the intonations in my voice all contribute to my success rate. I could sell a book of lines that are guaranteed to work because I think this is how I pick them up, when in fact, the lines could have very little to do with how I'm actually communicating. In contrast, if someone was to watch me operate, they would more than likely learn more from watching me do it than listening to me describe how I think I do it. And to this end, when they say "this is how you should do it", but then cannot show themselves that it is in fact how they do it... well... that raises huge flags! Thanks for saying you understand.