murray, I can see thinking about trends, etc. as well . Just haven't done that as often. When I made this thread, I didn't mean it so much like I was trying to invent new risk free ways to trade or anything, just trying to keep the mind sharp as to good ways to use options. What do you do with real estate? I have a few small investments in it myself. I would like to see the RE market get going a bit again - I'm no expert, but I would like to see them lower rates to the 3% range like some home builders have recommended. That would help get RE and the ecomony going. As far as running, I have ran a 10K and a 5K and am trying to get better.