A dietitian weighs in on the Ketogenic diet for weight loss

Discussion in 'Health and Fitness' started by Frederick Foresight, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. Well I dont know what the answer is because personally I never considered keto diets for someone looking to get shredded or perform as a professional athlete.

    But a person can do keto and still maintain lean body mass while losing fat. better approach is cycling in and out which is what most people do.
     
    #51     Mar 16, 2018
  2. punisher

    punisher

    I'm not going to be an advocate of Keto diet. I tried it once and lasted about a month or so, I could stand it and I couldn't lift wights while on it. It is hard to sustain this diet knowing how many great food items you have to skip (i.e. most fruits)

    But this diet does make a lot of sense. You can't burn fat in the presence of insulin. And don't confuse whether it "works" with "fitness personalities". I could go on TRT now (like most of those male "personalities" you follow) and not even worry about keto, yet I would quickly go from my ~20% body fat much closer to 10. That's the increased metabolic rate affect from TRT.

    Also, you can "get there" in many different ways. You can lower calorie consumption and up aerobics and finally you will get there. But the question is how much do you have to starve yourself (you have to in order to be in negative territory) and how much (what kind, how long) aerobics you need to do to "get there". Just see how much prep work is done for the competitions and how much lean tissue they need to lose because of that starving!

    To beauty of keto is that if you lower fat intake to get to negative territory, you will burn your body fat without much exercise at all.

    It should be pretty obvious, that once you "get there" (whichever way) then it is much easier to "stay there". You can eat whatever you want as long as your overall calorie consumption does not exceed your body needs.

    And finally, it would be beneficial to narrow down the definition of "shredded". What kind of body fat % are we talking about here. About 8-10% is pretty much the most you can get (sustained). Anything lower than that it temporary for the competition (at the expense of lean mass) at least you're juicing heavily.

    I'm just tired of all those fitness "personalities" giving advices to others. First thing they should say/proof is whether they are juicing (including TRT) or not. I have no problems at all with gear, it's just makes it a different ball game for each and every aspect of it, including diet, exercises, stamina, determination and motivation.
     
    #52     Mar 17, 2018
  3. Pekelo

    Pekelo

    Bingo!! The study I quoted mentioned 1 pound loss per week without any extra exercise. Throw in your favorite work out as extra calorie burn, do the math and there you are in weight loss paradise!
     
    #53     Mar 17, 2018
  4. Visaria

    Visaria

    Weightlifting (vigorous effort) has an expenditure value of 0.048 kcal/lb/min*. Note that this is total energy expenditure. Let's say you are a 170 pound guy. So for one hour of pure, no breaks or rest periods between sets, the amount of calories used is 490. However, it's unlikely that you would be lifting continuously for a hour, you are likely to have rest periods, water breaks, checking out the other guys and girls at the gym. So realistically, you'll do about half an hour to 45 mins in total of pure heavy lifting. So the calories used is gonna be 245 to 368. However we now have to deduct the basal rate i.e. the energy used if you were doing nothing. Say you need 3000 cal a day just to maintain yourself....3000/24 = 125...deduct that and you have the figure of 120 to 243 calories expended.

    Using pink dumbells might be even lower :D

    * source: rolfes, pinna, whitney, Understanding Normal and Clinical Nutrition, 9th edition
     
    #54     Mar 17, 2018
  5. Visaria

    Visaria

    These studies beg to differ.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1844567

    Following intense exercise resulting in high concentrations of muscle lactate, muscle glycogen synthesis occurs at between 15-25 mmol.kg-1 wet wt.hr-1. These synthesis rates occur without ingested carbohydrate during the recovery period and are maintained when a low intensity active recovery is performed.


    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8455450

    75% of glycogen restored after 6 hours even though nothing but water was consumed.
     
    #55     Mar 17, 2018
  6. Visaria

    Visaria

    The authors of that study said:

    We have demonstrated that using VLCKD [ketogenic] for a relatively short time period (i.e. 30 days) can decrease body weight and body fat without negative effects on strength performance in high level athletes.

    So don't understand your post tbh.
     
    #56     Mar 17, 2018
  7. Visaria

    Visaria

    Yes. I lost 20kg of fat during a ketogenic diet (mildly so since the daily net carb amount varied from around 25g to 75g) and I actually gained strength (i could lift heavier and more reps).

    Btw, i'm a certified personal trainer (but i don't train anyone apart from myself). So i guess i'm qualified to regurgitate theory and post meaningless studies. How about you?
     
    #57     Mar 17, 2018
  8. There you go again. More off topic studies. I’m starting to see the pattern.

    No one is arguing that glycogen cant be replineshed without carbs but that’s only true if you are not restricting cals below your TDEE. As a certified personal trainer you should be able to make that distinction. Run a caloric deficit and there’s not enough fat or protein to burn so there goes the muscle and last I checked this was a weight loss thread.

    Regardless, I’ve grown tired of this circular discussion and will now digress before my glycogen supplies get melted any further.
     
    #58     Mar 18, 2018
    Frederick Foresight likes this.
  9. Still more of an intelligent convo in here than in trading threads haha
     
    #59     Mar 18, 2018
  10. Visaria

    Visaria

    That's what you were precisely arguing:


     
    #60     Mar 18, 2018