You are right Mav. Every life is exactly as valuable as any other. Every family suffers exactly the same if their kin are killed at Hiroshima or on the beach at Normandy the same as if they were randomly sniped by the Son of Sam killer. Or killed in a mugging in Central Park. Or even killed by a slip on the ice with no one at fault. Unless of course they were killed in Vietnam before JFK committed more troops. Then, as you can see, these losses of life aren't quite so important. At least not to someone with a complete political slant or an argument to make on every topic: Those two soldiers lives were less important to their families because they were killed when Eisenhower was in the Whitehouse? Max somehow seems to have a tone of vilification of JFK for sending 100 soldiers to Vietnam in his first 6 months in office. This coming from Max the Hawk? (Gee, 100? Is that too much or too little?....hard to tell in this context...except the the "your pal" part. That leads me to believe 100 was too many). I am not looking to get into another pissing match with Max. As a matter of fact, I won't respond to his sure to come acrid response. But I had to use this example in this context. It seems to me that you (MAV) are right. We agree here. Each death is exactly as important and exactly as devastating as any other. Great numbers of deaths in no way diminish the value of any one life lost. When will we start to agree that we are ALL AMERICANS? (Or mostly Americans, but presumedly all civilized peace loving guys just trying to support ourselves and our families in somewhat the same way....trading....the common thread between us all). When will the partisan name calling and political divisiveness stop making us ALL laughable? No problem arguing politics. Or even religion. But why the name calling? What don't I get? Mav, in the "Mav and RS only" thread, I came back to see it had developed into a free for all. When you wanted to keep it "private" I thought you were making a mistake. Now I am not so sure. Because the "outside agitators" have caused a lot of name calling. Why does this seem unavoidable? I can argue with you, and you with me, but I don't recall any name calling between us ever. Insults? Yeah, things could be taken that way I suppose. All a matter of perception. However speaking for myself, I NEVER meant to attack you as a person. Only some of your beliefs. But beliefs are just that. Not right or wrong. Just different ways of looking at things. But crude name calling? Not that I remember. Am I mistaken? Mav, don't be pulled down by others. You may be a badly misguided right wing reactionary maniac, but that in no way makes you a bad person!!!!! Pabst called me a "Prick", and I have not let him live it down. I actually happen to like Pabst a lot. I respect that he backs up his beliefs with action. (As do you. As do I). So I will get as much mileage out of his calling me a "prick" as I can...sort of a friendly ball busting thing....although I know I should stop....he did apologize. And for that, Pabst gets a lot of points. Apologies are perhaps the most rare thing we find on ET. Really almost unheard of. Longshot apologized to me once (as he needed to in that particular instance). As off the wall as I think Longshot is most of the time (even when I agree with him, which is often, but in discussions I try to stay clear of), in general I find him too far over the top. But that one little apology has made me look at him in a whole new light. Hell, if Longshot can do it, anyone can. Peace, RS
You don't think that Bush is 'profiting from 9/11 when he has openly said several times that he is 'betting' his presidency on 9/11 and the 'war on terror"
Yes but he did not say back in 2000, hey guys, you what would be great, if we got attacked on our soil by Muslim fundamentalists killing 3,000 Americans, we could use this to win in 2004. That never happened, it wasn't planned. Clarke made a conscience effort with the marketing of this book and his interviews to fully exploit the worst disaster in the history of this country to make over a million bucks. Now if he donates all that money to charity, I will take back my words. Fat chance of that happening though.
"It's all about greed. He shouldn't be doing this. He's showing a lack of loyalty to the president. It's awful." Oh it's about loyalty to the president that's why it's awful...
And is it more or less awful that James Baker a director of Carlyle Group, as well as George Bush Senior, which was even CEO for 4 years - and still plays the seller's man all over the world for this group notably in south korea - and acting for the interest of Ben Laden family investment who was main shareholders of Carlyle, now defends the same Saudi Arabia interest againt the 9/11 family ? James Baker Defending Saudis against 9-11 Families' Lawsuit http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3067906/ "Saudis hire some of the toniest U.S. law firms to defend them against the landmark $1 trillion lawsuit on behalf of the victims of 9-11. So why is the plaintiffâs counsel ecstatic? Plus, new heat on radical imam" "April 16 - After months of working below the radar, a huge U.S. legal team hired by the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia has sprung into action and begun a major counteroffensive against a landmark lawsuit seeking $1 trillion in damages on behalf of the victims of the September 11 terror attacks. THE OPENING DEFENSE SALVO in what promises to be a bruising legal battle was fired last week when a trio of lawyers from Baker Botts, a prestigious Houston-based law firm, filed a motion on behalf of Prince Sultan bin Abdul Aziz, the Saudi defense minister. The motion attacked the 9-11 lawsuit as a âbroadside indictment of Saudi government, religion and culture.â It also argued that, as the third-ranking official of a foreign government, their client is immune from any U.S. legal action and that he should therefore be dismissed from the case altogether. But in laying out their arguments, Sultanâs U.S. lawyers also presented highly detailed new evidence of the Saudi governmentâs role in funneling millions of dollars to a web of Islamic charities that are widely suspected by U.S. officials of covertly financing the operations of Al Qaeda and other international terrorist groups." ... "Baker Botts, Sultanâs law firm, for example, still boasts former secretary of State James Baker as one of its senior partners. Its recent alumni include Robert Jordan, the former personal lawyer for President Bush who is now U.S. ambassador to Saudi Arabia."
Yes it is not fiction but "hereinreality.com" http://www.hereinreality.com/ Those who would support Bush for this are just supporting traitors to America for Saudi Arabia interest.
I agree with pretty much everything you said here and btw, I never supported the war in Vietnam. There seem to be a lot of people on ET, and it's not just here in chit achat but also in the trading forum that like to belittle others around them. That's how they like to argue. It seems like most threads ultimately lead to name calling because both sides become frustrated with the other. RS, this is precisely why I wanted to keep the Mav and RS thread between you and me. And sure enough, some posters could not resist to not only come in, not only post off topic, but pick a topic that they knoew would be controversial that would lead to mudslinging. Why people on ET do this I do not know. Oh well, I guess that's the cost of admission these days.
strange im having a hard time finding info on the supposedly fixed options. "The SEC filing showed that Cheney exercised options for 300,000 shares on Aug. 21 for $21 a share. He sold the stock the same day for $52.28 a share. The day after that, he exercised options for 95,000 shares at $26.44 each, then sold them for $52.99 a share. " sounds like regular stock options to me. http://www.cnn.com/2000/ALLPOLITICS/stories/09/12/campaign.cheney.halliburton.reut/ o/h/l/c for hal on aug 21 and 22 22-Aug-00 53.38 53.94 52.38 53.31 2,692,200 49.35 21-Aug-00 53.12 53.69 52.00 53.44 1,837,600 49.47
I must say that I am surprised that no one has mentioned the San Francisco based engineering firm, Bechtel and former Secretary of State George Schultz profiting off of the invasion of Iraq. Interesting.
No, his options get exercised every month or every qtr, what ever they agreed to regardless of the stock price. Most CEO's in the world have the same compensation plan. Look buddy, this has been discussed ad nauseam, get over it already. There is nothing about Cheney's compensation plan that is any different then Jack Welch's or anybody else. One day you are going to understand that.