440% Return: What should be Payout

Discussion in 'Professional Trading' started by Jrmarketwizard, Feb 23, 2007.

  1. I was hired on with a temporary contract with a boutique hedge fund, I was alloted a small amount about 100K. I specialize in futures specifically the indicies, currencies and energy.

    My first year out I did about 440%, (i'm up 50% thus far this year) my cut is 25% of gross. With my returns last year they've doubled up my asset size.

    Was curious to know what industry standard payout should I be looking at if I decide to shop around, the firm is great and I have all the freedom and very little oversight. I can provide all my equity runs

    I have no interest in trading stocks, but again what are the industry standard payout levels.

    Thanks.
     
  2. Take your 100k payout and strike it out on your own. None of the market wizards work for anyone else! :eek:
     
  3. Pekelo

    Pekelo

    I don't know the answer, but it is sure nice to have the security of trading OPM. I would probably play this way:

    1. Stay with the firm, after all if you repeat the performance, since you have twice the accountsize, you also double your risk free payout.

    2. Play on the side your own money too. This way you get best of both worlds.

    Also you might try to ask for a raise, but if you like the company don't push them too hard. A 5-10% raise sounds reasonable...
     
  4. Seriously, if they only give you $100K-$200K to work with and you can generate those returns with that amount of money, why wouldn't you just trade your own money and keep 100%?
     
  5. This year my account has been alloted just shy of 1 million dollars.

    They cover all my expenses, eating, living, travel and in the winter I can trade remotely in their Caribbean office.

    440% is an anomalous return but I believe I can comfortable to 1/8th of that year in year out.

    Ideally I would like to raise enough personal capital to go out on my own, I think 500k-1M would be sufficient. Again I can't look at 440% as realistic return performance year and year out, but at 40-50% on 500K, its not a bad living.

    I was offered to go out on my own to start a hedge fund, but the idea of running a business with administration and regulatory oversight its just not for me, I'm rather low key I like to be free and go as I please.

    I was curious to know if there are firms out there that pay a higher share of the profit cut to their trader, this way I can cut down the time I need to be in the industry.

    I'm considering sending my resume and equity run to CFT Financial, that's Andrew Pristons firm or aka Braveheart. Anyone know how they run as a group
     
  6. Pekelo

    Pekelo

    Quote from Jrmarketwizard:

    This year my account has been alloted just shy of 1 million dollars.

    This is not what you said in your first post. So if you repeat what you did last year, you got a 10 times raise.

    They cover all my expenses, eating, living, travel and in the winter I can trade remotely in their Caribbean office.

    You got all that and none of the stress of trading your own money. I would stick around for 1-2 more years, and by then you should have enough capital on your own, plus a longer trading record...
     
  7. sorry if I was unclear, i started with 100k and made over 400%, so my new starting capital was 500k for 2007, and they threw in additional 100k last month. I'm up 50% this year so my last NAV was around 910.

    Typically the firm will pull out all the gains, but they decided to leave it, so from the end of last year to now, my assets have doubled.
     
  8. S2007S

    S2007S

    I agree with moneyball. Doesnt make any sense. 440% return and your working for someone else. WITH that kind of return you should be doing it yourself, even with a 10,000 start by the end of the year you would be up 40k.
     
  9. LOL

    If I was living back in the basement with my mother 40K would suffice.

    There is also one glaring condition that is overwhelmingly ignored when trading your own capital. The subtle and additional stress of not having an insurance policy, OPM affords me a leisurely pace where I can enjoy life.

    In the past running a trading operation underfunded while putting food on the table every night is not a desirable position to be in. You have to trade from a state a "not wanting". Mind must be clear and free of any restraints.

    This game pulls and exploits all recess of insecurities a man possess, it is not natural and hence why so many fail. Its only when you finally don't fight it falls in place
     
  10. this is sound advise...can you trade a smaller account on the side mr. wizard? eventually you're gonna want to keep ALL your gains
     
    #10     Feb 23, 2007