Understanding day trading on margin account without leverage

Discussion in 'Trading' started by swissarmyknife, Apr 13, 2020.

  1. I'd love your clear explanations on something I still struggle wrapping my head around, despite reading IB's documentation and messaging them. I'd specifically like to understand how to day trade stocks without having to wait for trades to settle and without using any leverage/loan whatsoever.

    Let's assume a margin account (to avoid any free-riding violation) and a total account value well above 25K USD (to avoid the Pattern Day Trade rule).

    Let's assume day trading as follows:
    • Cash available in account: $110K
    • Day 1: buying X for $100K (keeping 10K in cash for any fees, etc.)
    • Same day, later: selling X for $90K
    • Same day, later: buying X for $90K
    • Same day, later: selling X for $100K
    • Same day, later: buying X for $90K
    • Day 2: selling X for $100K
    • Same day, later: buying X for $90K
    Day 1's trades would settle 3 days later, but in the meantime there would be day 2's trades: is there any margin loan in that case, specifically between day 3 and day 4? Is there something I'm missing if we extend the scenario to many more buy/sell trade orders during days 1, 2 or 3?

    Thank you for your help!
     
  2. Robert Morse

    Robert Morse Sponsor

    swissarmyknife-Would you like to give me a quick call. I will explain and answer your questions.
     
  3. Thank you, Robert. Unfortunately I'm not a US resident so not sure it would be worth your time? Would love to have some pointers though!
     
  4. Robert Morse

    Robert Morse Sponsor

    We take foreign accounts, but I was not looking to take you away from your broker. It would just be faster.
     
  5. kandlekid

    kandlekid

    • Cash available in account: $110K
    • Day 1: buying X for $100K (keeping 10K in cash for any fees, etc.)
    • Buying power 10K.
    • Same day, later: selling X for $90K
    • Buying power 100K.
    • Same day, later: buying X for $90K
    • Buying power 10K.
    • Same day, later: selling X for $100K
    • Buying power 110K.
    • Same day, later: buying X for $90K
    • Buying power 20K.
    • Day 2: selling X for $100K
    • Buying power 120K.
    • Same day, later: buying X for $90K
    • Buying power 30K.
    I don't think there is any margin loan required. As long as your trade does
    not exceed your buying power (the cash portion). You really don't have to worry about
    settlement unless you intend to withdrawal the proceeds of the trades from your account.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2020