Hello, The prop firm I trade at has recently bought a whole bunch of servers so that its traders (like me) can trade fully automated strategies in various futures products across the CME, ICE, Liffe and Eurex. I'm looking for blossoming algo traders that want to work with an experienced trader in designing algos that can be run intraday in whatever product you can design an algo for. The benefit of working with a professional firm/me is that we can trade strategies that would not be possible in a retail accounts, and we have the ability to buy as much as we want and hold anything overnight and not worry about margin calls. Since we are CME members our commissions are probably 1/4 of what retails brokers like IB can do and our servers are colocated in Chicago. So what is the benefit for divulging your algo ideas you say? 1.If we happen to stumble upon a profitable strategy with good risk rewards, I will split the profits with you. There's no incentive for me to steal your algo and run because the market changes often rendering once profitable algos useless. Thus if you have designed 1 profitable strategy, it means you are capable of designing more. 2.You don't run the risk of loosing any money in testing these algo ideas. Because only in a live market can you really tell if it works or not (simulation only testing doesn't cut it). I'll be liable for all losses. Go ahead and backtest all you want but I will be forward testing in live and simulation. 3.You can learn what works, why it works, and run the same algos for yourself on your own account if you wish only after I've thoroughly tested them and proven to be money makers. So the risk in finding the golden nuggets is all mine. 4.You get the benefit of working with an experienced and profitable futures trader with programming abilities who can help you in your own trading and guide you into what inefficiencies we could exploit. 5.You can design algos that are marginally profitable (the only reason they are profitable is because commissions are super cheap, some examples: ES 1.08 per lot per Roundtrip, Eurodollars 0.78 per RT, CL 1.80 per RT) Feel free to design something that overtrades like crazy as long as it makes money. 6. We use Xtrader Pro with autospreader so we can create algos for outright futures or synthetic spreads or exchange traded spreads. 7. I can assist in the design process as I have a good idea on what tends to work and what's a bad idea or too risky to begin with. Our combined efforts would be a more powerful combination than just you working by yourself. I also have close relationships with a few much more experienced traders than I that I can bounce ideas from. 8.If I see a lot of programming and trading abilities in you I can probably assist you in getting a job or trade for your own account in the prop shop I work at. Of course that's down the road. The parameters for the algo strategies is as follows: -Must have short holding periods, nothing more than a couple hours unless the product is extremely slow moving. -Must be futures only on CME, Liffe, Eurex, ICE -I don't mind if it's an illiquid product as long as it's tradeable and moves enough. -I will have to know exactly how it works as I will have to code it from scratch based on your idea. I will not be able to take your Ninjatrader code and convert it. I wont' be able to take your algo and do some kind of black box trading without me knowing exactly what it's doing. -Must trade frequently in order to validate the edge. No 1 trade a week type of thing. -Keep it simple, ultra complex strategies will be hard to code and also not as likely to trade often and does not make it more likely that it will be profitable. The simplest algos I have are the most profitable. If that sounds like a decent proposition please PM me and we can take it from there. For all the hate mail I will inevitably get please PM that too.
sounds like bullshit to me. All the points you mention speak in your favor and not in favor of the one who develops said strategies. I have gone through the same spiel uncountable times, albeit when investment banks and hedge funds attempted to hire me and still do. Most non-hft houses scramble for algorithmic strategies and they tell you anything you wanna hear to hand over the code. Summary of the whole story is this: If one can develop profitable trading strategies then one ought to fund his own strategies or trade them or better, seek investors and start a venture on his/her own. Why should I pass on the core code to you? And another big red warning flag to anyone who develops trading strategies and is approached by people like OP : If your suggestion to release the strategy as black-box or the idea of hiring you and then develop code in-house is vehemently rejected then run as fast as you can, "code steal" warning alarms should be screaming! Here is the translation of your post for all those who are a little thick between the ears: 1) I tell you whatever you want to hear but once I got the code its mine and whatever contract we may have in place you cannot prove anyway whether I use it or not. I of course have a lot of incentive to possess profitable code today, whether it stops working tomorrow or not. 2) I indirectly tell you that you are retarded, commercially speaking: I concede that you are brilliant in developing trading strategies that work in non-over fitted backtests, forward tests, any scrambled data period, yet I tell you that you must give me the the code so that I can test it live. 3) As if you dont know what works and what does not work AFTER developing profitable trading strategies I tell you that you giving me your code is my risk, lol (ups omit the lol as I try to sell snake oil here) 4) I dont know shit and dont know how to program and especially I do not know how to develop profitable trading strategies, thats why I come to ELITE TRADER to ask some smart Computer Science/Quants who are, however, commercially retarded to hand over their code base. 5) As if all the other 500 shops cannot give the same or more competitive rates I bollock you into the belief that my deal is the best. (of course I conveniently omit that you could also develop currency based strategies and sign up with a RETAIL Interactive Brokers account and trade EUR/USD with ZERO slippage (in fact most of the time slight price improvements) at an average spread of 0.2 pips + about 1.8$ per 100,000 units traded (which amounts to 0.0015% of price or 0.15 basis points plus 0.0018% or 0.18 basis points = 0.0033%, which contrasts with my ES quote (not round trip) of 0.026% or 2.6 basis points plus 0.013% or 1.3 basis points spread => 12 times the total costs of execution you get from IB for currencies. But of course I do not mention that and I also do not mention that the momentum to develop algorithmic trading strategies is on the currency side and not stock and futures side) 6) Not that you cannot access exchange traded products such as spreads directly at the exchange with ANYONE that connects with said exchange, and not that with algorithm and especially order execution skill sets one can build and execute any synthetic products at will, but I bullshit you into believing you need Xtrader Pro and its autospreader to accomplish the same. 7) And I also shut up about the fact that I know shit how to design and implement profitable trading strategies, but hey, its sounds convincing to tell you that I "know how to program", "I have many good ideas", "I know what works and what does not", "I know how to design trading algorithms". Sounds like the start of a buddy relationship right? Oh did I forget to mention that I bend over backwards to sit at the same lunch table with some guys who make money at my prop firm? That qualifies me for stealing code from you right? 8) So, first give me your fucking code and maybe (actually not) I could help to get you hired. (well drop the latter part of the previous sentence you stupid idiot). Here my requirements - Must generate > 10 sharpe ratios - I need to know exactly how it works else I would not be able to steal your code and employ it in my firm to take all the credit myself - Dont give me fucking ninja code I need C++ code but if you could actually code up your strategies on a hardware frame programmable gate array (FPGA) that would be awesome - Please make sure your 10 sharpe ratio code does contain more than 20 lines of code because I am actually retarded and cannot understand more than that -END OF TRANSLATION- DUDE, get the FUCK out of here, this must be the most outrageous and ridiculous attempt to steal code I have seen so far in 2014. (You do not top, however, other bs I have seen in the past).
OK except the amount of PM's I got already for people wanting to work with me suggests you are wrong. Not everyone has the resources to pull off automated strategies. I do. Thanks for coming out.
Sure, good luck with your snake oil approach. What resources do you have in Vancouver that others do not have, an internet connection to Chicago? Lol!!!
We bought dedicated servers at a cost of 10's of thousands of dollars. Does that answer your question.
oh, now its "we"? You described yourself as just a guy of an average prop shop. Now you are part of management or IT?
you know what ,i think you and second poster in your thread are the same person second post is just a bite ,hahha i tell you ,those who have robust strategy and have nots think differently i normally do not log in, but i said i will write a warning, let you readers help think through what is what.