hey guys, i'm completely new to trading, and haven't even started paper trading yet. i really don't know much - i'm spending about 2 weeks doing a lot of research and self-education. doing forex AND stocks is important to me, because i want to START with stocks, since my startup capital is limited. one of the issues is that i'm a web developer, so i only have linux computers. essentially all trading platforms run on windows. i was able to get metatrader5 to run on linux via wine, and noticed it was a very robust platform, and could trade STOCKS and forex, so i'm fairly firm on using only metatrader 5, rather than another software client. what i was wondering, is WHO i should use to do my trading with. is there a broker out there who (1) lets its clients use metatrader (2) trades STOCKS (3) trades forex (4) has a 800$ or less minimum deposit (5) doesn't rape you with their fees??? also, i'm wondering if i need to use a traditional online broker, or if i can use a (DMA broker? ECN?) and cut out the middle man, if i'm even asking the right question??? thanks in advance for any guidance you can provide.
I don't think it exists .... maybe some international broker. The bigger issue is why try to do both. They are different worlds, and it may take you years to be successful at just one.
Fix this first before worrying about brokers. You're being a typical techie (I'm one too, so I had to overcome this myself years ago) by trying to analyse the every aspect of the tools that 'could' be used without even knowing how to swing a hammer yet. Here's a tip though: Any broker offering stocks through MT4/5 are likely just offering "CFDs" on the stock, not the stock itself. The difference is huge, and any 'costs' you think you're saving by avoiding a commission fee from a stock broker are going to be 'hidden' and more costly through a padded spread and financing (rollover) costs of CFDs.
it would appear that you are either a "selective reader", or, simply, "illiterate". if you don't know what guidance is, then i suppose i can not hold it against you, but, it certainly is not ridicule; further more, to ridicule a person who admits ignorance indicates a simpleton who needs to feel important. this is not good for website visitors with similar questions, and, it detours potential new members from even asking questions. i'll let that go, for the sake of staying on topic. now, i've shared what i am hoping to find, so, you should only reply with suggestions that are some what compatible, or closer to the direction of, that which i was asking about the existence of. if some thing i asked is not feasible, then, which condition is it? what are likely conditions that need to change to find the best match? price is not some thing i can flex on right now, but other conditions are open to change (such as the software platform). am i to understand that the condition you found the most objectionable was that of the initial deposit for a prop firm? i've also understood from the previous reply that i may need to seek out 2 different merchants / brokers, which is acceptable if it means that most of the other conditions would be met. so, on this updated understanding, are there any suggestions? thanks in advance.
@Jack_Larkin: thank you very much for that information. it appears i will have to change my direction a bit, if not entirely, for now. at least i got some clarity from this, regarding my next moves, and where i should be looking. thanks again.
i do have a now question, that is a bit more on-topic for this subcategory of the forum, and in follow up to your suggestions... if i understand one of the differences between a prop firm and a retail firm, i SHOULD be able to execute MORE than 3 trades per week, without a 25k$ deposit, right? THEN, the next question is, do most prop firms require a larger deposit than most retail firms? for example, "you can trade more than 3 times per week with under 25k$ in your account, BUT, your minimum deposit is 10k$"? i'm sure i can get some quick answers from wikipedia on it, that are good in THEORY, but, in PRACTICE, from your experiences, does this seem to be correct? am i looking at a much higher deposit than 800$, am i still limited in trades, even if my balance stays positive? thanks again.
I just started trading a few months ago, so I understand how many questions you must have! First, a prop firm requires that you be licensed. If they don't, you should seriously question the reputation of the company and dig deeper. Many offshore "prop" firms are being shut down right now, with or without returning customers' capital. Second, retail broker per trade fees are ridiculous, and they do require at least $25K for day trading. This is an SEC rule, unfortunately. Find a US based company with a good reputation and longevity. There are US based hedge funds that are operating something like prop firms, but you will need to be accredited (pass a couple of quizzes to show that you are educated about trading) or meet other requirements that most of us can't meet, unless you are in the 1%. Also, what education do you have for day trading? I definitely recommend understanding setups and risk management before you start. Think or Swim (TD Ameritrade) has a decent paper trading platform. Also, Real Fast Trader has a paper trial for DAS Trader. I can't speak to Real Fast Trader's credentials as a company. Hope that helps. I am just learning a lot of this stuff about the different firms myself and don't want anyone to lose their hard earned money because of some disreputable offshore company.
as far as "education" goes, i just did my own research and self education. i'd like to think i learned a lot, however, it does not matter now... i'm a linux user, and there is NO equities software for linux, and none of the windows software from the brokerages are TRUE installers (they're all JAVA apps), so i cant install them under WINE, and, though metatrader5 now does equities, brokerages do not allow you to use it - you must use their in house platform. i spent DAYS calling brokerage after brokerage, trying to see they had an API i could use metatrader5 with. none of them did except TDA, but, after giving me the run-around for a couple of weeks, they wouldn't give me the API access information. so i said "fuck equities: i'm going to forex". i went to MBT (MB Trading) and started an account. they provide MT4 access, at the moment. they don't use MT5 yet, but they will be, and they will allow you to trade equities via MT5 in the future. they also have 2 different account types for forex: FreeEXN and PayPerTrade - the latter is the typical flat fee, and the former is where there is no trade fee, but you must buy over a spread. they also have papertrading, and you can add papertrade accounts under your main account. it seems they are more progressive than the large conventional brokerages, even if their website is complete crap. i told them if they could get their website to be as good as their offerings, they would be unstoppable. i didn't think to tell them i was a master web developer (when i wanna be). they've won a lot of awards too, for their service, so that is a big plus for trust.
there are a few sites with detailed listings of prop firms / dma brokers. once site is here at Proprietary Trading and another can be found here Investimonials