China to lose population

Discussion in 'Wall St. News' started by zdreg, Jan 18, 2023.

Will China loss of population lead to worldwide destabilization

  1. Yes, politically

    1 vote(s)
    10.0%
  2. Yes, economically

    1 vote(s)
    10.0%
  3. no, politically

    4 vote(s)
    40.0%
  4. no , economically

    1 vote(s)
    10.0%
  5. I don't care.

    6 vote(s)
    60.0%
Multiple votes are allowed.
  1. zdreg

    zdreg

    China’s population decline could shake the world - analysis
    [​IMG]jpost.com/international/article-728972
    [​IMG]
    A report this week said that China’s population declined last year for the first time since a brief decline in the 1960s. The reports on this decline have many seeing a “bleak” future for China and also a “demographic crisis, according to some of the headlines reporting the major shift.

    On the one hand, China’s declining birthrate and aging population can be seen as part of a global trend. Many wealthy industrialized countries have low birth rates and many countries are seeing a possible decline in population in the long term. However, China’s changes have more implications for the world than those in Japan, Italy or other countries, because of the huge size of China and the way the world has been seeing China’s rise over the last decades.

    First of all, what do the reports say?
    NBC News noted, “China said Tuesday that its population declined last year for the first time in six decades, a historic shift with profound implications for the world’s second-largest economy.” This report said that “officials from the National Bureau of Statistics said mainland China had 1.41175 billion people at the end of 2022, compared with 1.41260 billion a year earlier, a decrease of 850,000. There were 9.56 million births — a record low birth rate of 6.77 per thousand — and 10.41 million deaths.”

    Back in 2021, CNN noted that “China’s birthrate in 2020 has hit another record low – and there’s no indication things are about to pick up anytime soon.” That report went on to note that “there were only 8.5 births per 1,000 people in China last year, according to the latest yearbook released by the country’s National Bureau of Statistics in late November.” The fact is that China’s birthrate decline is huge. According to the reports in 2021, there was an 18% decline in the number of babies born between 2019 and 2020.

    Demographics and predictions are always problematic because people tend to project a trend into the future and then say that if this trend continues then “X” will happen. But people are not simple data points, sometimes birth rates increase or decrease. Nevertheless, the population in China is aging. It is also aging in Russia and other places.

    [​IMG][​IMG]China and United States flags (credit: REUTERS)
    For instance, reports in 2022 said that Russia’s population was in historic decline. This is despite the fact that Russia’s leader has sought to portray his country as some kind of strong representation of Christian European civilization supposedly combating the “woke” ideologies of the West.

    China is not like Russia
    Most experts can see that Russia’s population is aging and declining and that economically Moscow is not that important. China is different. It is important and it is becoming more assertive. However, its one-child policy and other policies, such as zero-COVID, have come and gone. The leadership seems to know that they have mishandled things. As the population ages the country trends toward continuing to have one child for each two adults, even though the policy was ditched.



    This is said to be due to the new middle class that wants to invest in one child to succeed and sees affording kids as difficult. This is the middle-class privileged paradox that has already taken place in the West where having numerous children is seen as a burden and pathway to poverty. But what happens when a country like China, which had an expanding economy, suddenly has a decline?

    China was projected to continue expanding. The economic power of China was supposedly going to dominate the world. The pandemic however has given many countries pause. Now companies are slowly moving to manufacture elsewhere. They may be moving it to Vietnam or Malaysia or other countries, but the trend is clear; many companies think they need to hedge their bets. China is no longer the be-all-end-all answer to everything.

    Now comes the hard times. As China faces demographic changes and as it may become less productive it will need to seek stop-gap measures to ease the changes. For many years under Deng Xiaoping and later Jiang Zemin China was seen to be refos a motto the notion to “bide its time and hide its capabilties.” This was brought to fruition by Hu Jintao, who served as the general secretary of the Chinese Communist Party (CCP) from 2002 to 2012. Under Xi Jinping China has gone even further, asserting its power and no longer hiding or biding. This does not converge with the West as some hoped, testimony to the US-China Economic Review Commission in 2020 noted.

    While China shifted to being to exert its power, it has met increasing challenges. Angered by Covid and now suspicious of China, many western countries are rallying together. This occurs in alliances and partnerships that span Australia, South Korea, Japan, the US, India, UK and other countries. It happens in different ways, from countries concerned about China’s technology to concerns about Chinese students, data issues or other types of spying and theft, concerns about debt and even concerns about China and the WHO and UN. The US and the West are talking differently now and so is China.

    The West has its own problems
    A recent CNN report noted that “the top 1% have captured nearly twice as much new wealth as the rest of the world during that period, according to Oxfam’s annual inequality report, released Sunday. Their fortune soared by $26 trillion, while the bottom 99% only saw their net worth rise by $16 trillion.” New think tank war games reported on by western media show how much a struggle with China over Taiwan would be costly. The US is concerned about China’s rapid expansion of its navy. New weapons like lasers, drones and hypersonic missiles may change the future battlefield. Meanwhile, China is watching the West and Russia and the fighting in Ukraine and China is learning.

    The demographic long-term crisis in China could lead the ruling party to take more risks.If they think their long-term outlook of growth and power is slowing and that the West is now waking up, they may realize that time is running out and that a window of opportunity exists. Before the West can re-arm enough, and while China has a young generation of nationalists thirsty for more power, perhaps the new data could cause policies that lead to destabilization in the world. This is the unintended consequence of the new reports.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2023
  2. Nobert

    Nobert

    Can't have the cake and eat it too.

    Western life, - western age of civilization. Plus, they had a 1 baby policy & that made it even worse.

    Will the work force of surrounding nations (18-40 y.o males) migrate into China for better salaries ?
    Are those, - higher ?

    ,,Let's move into China, they offer some jobs. Don't mind 500 000 000 CCTV cameras with face recognition and the fact that we might end up in some distant concentration camp where we would loose our organs. All that matters, - the money is good. 20% more than here"
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2023
    murray t turtle likes this.
  3. Peter8519

    Peter8519

    All central family or population planning policies have been a disaster.
    Here is a good example.
    Population planning in Singapore - Wikipedia

    As for China, just multiply by another 300-400X.
    Forced abortion, infanticide just to name a few.
    Now, not enough.
     
    Nobert and murray t turtle like this.
  4. maxinger

    maxinger

    fewer people --->

    less pollution, less CO2, less greenhouse gas -->

    falling sea level
     
    murray t turtle likes this.
  5. maxinger

    maxinger

    upload_2023-1-19_10-50-15.png


    Population explosion due to advancements in science and technology.
    Can this tiny earth accommodate it?
     
    Pekelo and beginner66 like this.
  6. Sorry to say, we are on the back end of 250 years of government growth.
    Lately (past 50 years) it has been truly parabolic.
    And now the larder is empty, and everybody (governments) have tons of debt.
    Best thing to do is change the subject.
    Global Warming, viruses, etc will keeps most of the population occupied.
    If that falls short, find something else, anything else.
    And find it quickly.
    Last time this situation showed up, Joseph-Ignace Guillotin had a thriving practice as a physician.
    But ... he kind of got out of that business.
    Invest accordingly.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2023
    murray t turtle and NoahA like this.
  7. VicBee

    VicBee

    Off subject, Fail.
     
  8. TheDawn

    TheDawn

    Why would China's loss of population destabilize the world when there is India to replace it? LOL And why would any country's loss of population destabilize the world when we are moving towards complete automation with robots?
     
    Nobert likes this.
  9. VicBee

    VicBee

    China's situation is unusual because their population decline will be precipitous. Already today there are many more men than women in some regions. COVID is likely to kill between 2 and 3 million people, mostly elders but probably around 25% of working adults, and urban Chinese are no longer interested in having children. What are the consequences to expect?
    Full employment and higher pay. China's export directed economy will need to automate its manufacturing sector and let the machines do the work that today is done by thousands of low paid labor. China is unlikely to let in foreigners the way western nations have to compensate for their labor shortage.
    The Taiwan situation is time sensitive. China cannot have a million men military when there are not enough to plow the fields or work in offices. Xi is under pressure to trigger this war before the military shrinks for lack of men and due to tighter budgets. But a war means a further population shrinkage of able men and women and its outcome is uncertain. The economy minded apparatchiks may exert enough pressure to do away with Xi and his hawkish cohort in exchange for a conciliatory western response to the 1 China policy.
    A smaller China doesn't necessarily mean a weaker China. Their work ethic, competitive spirit and scientific prowess will continue to challenge western hegemony.
     
    Nobert likes this.
  10. Moranos

    Moranos

    If you look at the data, the EU, OECD, Japan, and USA and Russia have much older populations than China and crude death rates are higher than China.
     
    #10     Jan 19, 2023