Why strategies make money

Discussion in 'Trading' started by garachen, Nov 17, 2014.

  1. garachen

    garachen

    Out of the 6 'whys' I listed, I believe two are suitable for retail traders (people at a fee/speed disadvantage). After capitalizing on those two you should have enough $$$ to pursue the other 'whys' which generate more stable income.

    Which two to start with?
     
    #21     Nov 27, 2014
  2. First off, thanks for posting this. The other day I was working on something, and could see it was working a large portion of the time, but still was taking some larger losses at times. Your post reminded me to think about why it is working more than the fact it is working which helped with the process quite a bit.

    I would say #3 and #6, simply from the fact the rest probably require speed, a big account for it to work well, or significantly reduced commission. Although #3 I guess you still need to be pretty fast from a human standpoint to quickly figure out what to do based on the news.

    Hope you are doing well and had a good Thanksgiving!
     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2014
    #22     Nov 27, 2014
  3. Agree with your picks, although as an equities guy I'm surprised there are enough opportunities in either category in futures to make them interesting as a foundation for a trading business.
     
    #23     Nov 28, 2014
  4. londonkid

    londonkid

    Great post. Would you care to share an example. Of course i understand if you don't want to.
     
    #24     Nov 28, 2014
  5. garachen

    garachen

    Much of my Thanksgiving is held in a language I don't understand.

    Yeah. 3 and 6. You need to start with something that generates a high enough $/trade to overcome your commission disadvantage. Then use your success there to buy down your fees elsewhere.

    So, at first you should be in a place where algos have a disadvantage because it's a suboptimal environment for them.
     
    #25     Nov 28, 2014
    Iwilldoit likes this.
  6. Gambit

    Gambit

    What do you think of liquidity provision on a longer time frame? Putting limit orders much deeper in the book and combining that with longer term mean reversion?
     
    #26     Nov 28, 2014
  7. Very much enjoy garachens posts but re: "path towards profitability"
    * "Try to gain intuition to determine if there is selling pressure or buying pressure."
    * "not super news sensitive"

    * "But I would be curious if anyone were to follow my method to fruition."
    Difficult to reconcile this "path towards profitability" with #3 and #6. That path feels more like developing intuition for the ebb and flow rather than grabbing ticks on breaking news and spikes in VIX and gold.

    I am in awe of the people who are able to generate $5k/day from price ladders with <1 year experience. I used to literally sit 12 inches from my screen and block out everything else in the world except for the price ladder of one or two major Eurex products but must have been missing the magic ingredient.

    IMO if you want to trade news to build an account you need a bloomberg or reuters terminal to have a shot. I've sampled from the major Squawk boxes and the news which moves markets violently enough, was in my experience infrequent (<<1/month). With a BBG terminal probably would have gained the 8 second head-start on the Squawk boxes and made ~3 semi decent news trades/month.

    If I had my time again, I would have clicked buy/sell as soon as I saw the markets starting to run + the "click" of the squawkers microphone. Instead I waited around to try and judge the news and miss too much of the smaller moves.
     
    #27     Nov 28, 2014
  8. garachen

    garachen

    I think market conditions have changed since my original post on that other thread. Even a few years ago it was relatively easier to find products you could manual trade and grind out money daily.

    Nowadays, I think there's better opportunity in waiting, trading less, and only stepping in when the odds are greatly in your favor. That means very few trades per week and in moderate to large size.

    With low fees, the daily grind still works but with retail fees its harder to find the appropriate contracts and time of day than it used to be.

    Also, by trading on complex news I don't mean anything that is regularly scheduled. I mean random news whose primary source might not be English.
     
    #28     Nov 29, 2014
  9. I used to run a completely automated #1 in the equities market. It ran all day long in a couple of dozen symbols. For a couple of years it did well, but the returns are no longer there, so I've moved on. I'm now running a mostly automated (some trader input is needed throughout the day) that is a combination of #1 and #6 in futures. It starts making markets only in times of panic or over reaction. I've found this combination to be much more reliable than having it run at all times of the session with 100% automation.
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2014
    #29     Nov 29, 2014
    Ghost_of_Blotto likes this.
  10. garachen

    garachen

    It depends on several things.

    How thick is the book --> how much effort do you need to put into calculating the value of your position in line.

    How are you deciding when to cancel orders

    How are you managing the exit. And are you treating profitable or loss exits differently

    What effect are you trying to capture. A typical range mean reversion or a mean reversion due to abrupt overreaction.

    Think through these and then attempt to sim to see if $/trade is high enough for your cost structure. Or just run and find out. Maybe expensive to find out by running but at least it's accurate.
     
    #30     Dec 1, 2014