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What was your investment/trading gains in 2017?

  1. 2017 has just ended. Just wondering how have the elite traders and investors on this forum have perform? Is it normal to lose to the S&P500 index?

    For me personally, I lost to the index big time although my gains were worth a few months of salary bonus.
  2. +28%. In my retirement accounts, +22% in my trading account. So basically lower in my trading account than just an s&p etf. I blame it mostly on undisciplined stop resets.
  3. intangible,mostly.focusing 100% on finance in 2018,though.wish me a good luck!
  4. That sounds fine for most portfolio to underperform the spx in a year it's been on a rampage. Most portfolios only have a portion allocated to stocks, even less to US stocks. Than it depends what part of the portfolio you manage actively and with what objective.
    Anyway here a (very) good year in USD, I like to keep track in euro as well, and it will be far less exciting in that currency as I'd sold most of them before EUR went up.
    In holidays now, so numbers not finalised yet.
  5. Best year ever.
    Trading only ASX stocks, gold, copper, iron ore, coal, nickel, oil positions.
    There were moments my positions fell into the doldrums, at one stage about 2 months going nowhere, but this last month has been very good even though atm not in any gold trades and having considerable money parked on the sides awaiting.
    I'm hoping 2018 to be yet better again, have an Asus chromebook arriving this week from USA which I intend to use to set up a cloud based mobile stoploss system, just experimenting with an idea at this stage.
  6. How so you trade these markets?
  7. I had not-so-good year in ASX stocks although gains were still positive. When you refer to gold, copper, iron ore, coal, nickel, are they futures or ASX stocks?
  8. Trading stocks only on ASX.
  9. You are better than me. This year, my most disastrous stock picks came from ASX. Some examples were GEM.AX (fell >20% on one fine morning) and DOW.AX (fell >20% on another fine morning). Just writing this reply brings back painful memories.
  10. This year all the ducks were lined up....
    Many years of trading experience.
    No longer working for the man.
    At the right place at the right time, ASX is resources populated with quality stocks.
    Decided this year to becoming more focused on becoming focused, and this has paid off muchly. Taking your eye off the ball will hurt your results profoundly.
    Money makes money, compounding trade wins bring in more profits.
    Trading systematically but discretionally, rinse and repeat on a trading plan which has me very happy.
    Patience to wait, then strike.
    Researched heavily this year into improving my system, many hours.
    Copious note writing and system writing, bit of algo writing, but most of my trades are not algo based, my algo stuff is when mkt is dead and I need to hunt for new prey. Amibroker.
  11. Similar, +27% in retirement, 15% in trading account. Trading account was down early and has come on in the last 1/4.

    We'll see next year if the trading account improves otherwise it all goes into longer term stuff.

    Good luck to all in 2018!
  12. +31%, about +3% per month, one month ( June) down 4% due to emotional trading...
  13. +28% investment account, global ETF portfolio.
    +15% trading. Systematic with desc/manual entry/exit. Have to get better at taking the loss when indicated. No rationalising, justifying holding.
  14. Hard to be a calculating unemotional robot when bleeding or being greedy.
  15. I make this post with a "what's possible" heir to it, nothing else. I'm not interested in flames, critiques, or the standard ET bs that will likely be incited. I will merely ignore any such comments or discussion. Make all the juxtaposing, comparison, and analysis as you will. Elsewhere is a thread about Einhorn making only 2% in 2017 if that is more agreeable to your beliefs.

    I trade futures, intraday only, meaning flat end-of-day.
    Primary instruments NQ, YM, RTY. Some currency, gold, and copper. All intraday, flat end-of-day.

    2017 account growth... 140%, an engineered amount which includes 2017 distribution amount.
    2017 account withdraws (as pct of 2017 *starting* value)... 650%, also engineered with SS tax cap in mind.

    Best day money-wise... Dec 1, 2017
    7 worst days money-wise... max 1200 daily loss... a string of losing trades or a single trade gone wrong with me asleep at the switch. There were no "black swan" exchange outages or otherwise uncontrollable trading events for me during 2017.
    46 total (including worst) losing days money-wise. Note: I consider a losing day as less than 100 net.

    Overall, 2017 was a so-so year. Lack of volatility in the US indexes is the bane of my livelihood.

    Here's to the return of volatility in 2018, and a prosperous new year for all!!
  16. Clarify withdraws for me? To me it reads like you spent 5x what you gained this year? Also <100 net considered a loss, is that percent or dollars?, with only 46 losing days it wouldn't make sense for it to be percent based on your numbers.
  17. <<< Clarify withdraws for me? To me it reads like you spent 5x what you gained this year?

    I trade through an entity. I earn W2 wages. The entity generates 100% of it's income through trading as described.

    <<< Also <100 net considered a loss, is that percent or dollars?, with only 46 losing days it wouldn't make sense for it to be percent based on your numbers.

    US Dollars, net of costs. Less than 100 bucks is a losing day (to/for me).
  18. Still not entirely sure in the withdraw bit but thanks for answering.
  19. Its the word withdraw that's likely confusing. It's not technically withdraw, it's wages paid, directly (withdrawn) from the trading account. Trading account is swept to a minimum value regularly, it is not a store of cash other than what is necessary to conduct trading as described.
  20. May I ask why you do this? Pay yourself a w2 wage. The entity is either a pass through and you still pay taxes or it's not and it still pays taxes. What's your advantage in this structure.
  21. W2 wages is EARNED INCOME. Earned income is REQUIRED by the IRS for things like funding retirement to name but one. Additionally W2 allows for a much easier life regarding personal interests and other types of investments. Further, the structure (S-corp) provides means for employee benefits like health insurance among others and allows for expenses and deductions (at the entity level) not available to individual taxpayers. And not to be overlooked, is the feature of potentially tax-free distributions.

    2017 was ok, but not a great year trading-income-wise, which makes some of the entity benefits less "convincing". I understand your question.
  22. Good work mate.
  23. + about 50%. It was a terrible year. Did 750% last year. I traded all U.S. stocks, nothing sub $10. This year will be much better. Good luck to all.

  24. 50% gain across your whole trading portfolio and 750% the year prior?
    Approx size of portfolio?
    I did 25% gain on portfolio of my main busiest trading acc.
  25. I thought 2016 was terrible and 2017 was great. Interesting how these Dynamics work out.
  26. +25% for retirement and +33% for trading account, better than last year :)
  27. I love these discussions, but I believe they need some context, in particular:
    *return with either volatility or maximum draw-down of the year
    *some measure of the amount invested - for instance, months of income from your day job, or percentage of one's net assets

    On my side I've realized around 35% return with vol at 30%, on a portfolio of around 10% of my net assets (including housing/pension/car/wife/etc) - easily my best year ever, but I guess I could just have been long bitcoin or S&P with leverage...
  28. My as-traded gains barely beat the SPX which, as a premium seller (99.5%), is pretty miserable. But I would be happy with that, if I had lesser drawdowns -- minPortVar, if you will. (Yes, there are all sorts of issues with a minPortVar goal, but it's still part of what got drilled into my brain ancient years ago: maxPortValue subject to minPortVar. Harry Markowitz.) This last hit (being the pop that started on Thanksgiving) was, I thought, going to take a while to work through. But this morning (gaining the fruits of changes in tactics away from pure credit spreads), we're up 0.50% SPX, and net liq. climbs climbs climbs, to recover nicely from T'Ging.

    As a (one-time) runner, you want to have 3 goals -- a Minimum Acceptable, an As Expected, and a Blue Sky. 5 years ago, 1%/week was doable with one eye closed. Now??? (See picture below...) With the nice harvesting over the past two weeks (read: "recovery"), I'm breathing a big sigh of relief. With the fact of the drawdown (without having had one for 9?? months or so), I'm bummed. Given the environment (which may be structural, and therefore permanent), I should be doing backflips.


    I don't often take a look at things like week-long candles, but on a recent Saturday morning, I was putzing through the Interwebs (hence, "StockCharts.com"), and pulled up this shot, and thought "Of course!" :wtf:. As a proxy for IV, that ATR really tells the tale of what it's been like.

    Are things where I want? "No."
    But considering? *Really*?!?!? "Wow."
  29. 51%
  30. +17%. While working fulltime. No losing months. Pretty happy with the result.
  31. My algo generated 31.67% return with 13.01% DD and 5 losing months.
    Unfortunately only a part are live returns, part is demo.
    Live returns from the last 5 months of 2017 was 4.45% return which includes 2 of the 5 losing months.

    The algo only trades ZB, since this market was in a tight range during 2017 i can not complain with these results.

    2016 was a much better year for my algo.

  32. -50%. I am not an elite trader.
  33. That's pretty bad, and damaging. You should have pulled out and seriously reevaluate yourself and the market after losing around 1/3'rd of your account.

    Approach trading...with a collective wisdom about the thing you're trading and timeframe. and reasonable reward expectations, and risks. -- If you can't do that well, and explain it, and prove it...you're just being a dumb gambler. and have no purpose in the market.

    Most guys should not open a trading account at all. They're not cut out for it.
    Just buy a starter basic used stainless steel Rolex Submariner on eBay, a new gaming laptop, go get laid in Vegas by a hooker, eat at fine steak houses, and gamble the rest away.
    Atleast you will have a few nice things and memories of a good time. -- instead of a depleted trading account in the end, with nothing to show for it.
  34. +27% after taxes and fees,
  35. Here is a look at how your more passive investors did in 2017. Gen-X is rockin! About two-thirds of Americans have saved very little or nothing at all. Looks like Gen X is on track to not fall into that trap.

    According to Fidelity Investments, the average 401k balance increased to $99,900 in the third quarter while the average IRA balanced increased to $103,500. Fidelity found that the account balances in IRAs and 401k plans increased for every generation during the last year but that there was “significant growth” among Gen X investors. Among those savers, the IRA balances increased 16.5% to $51,000 while it increased 18% for 401K balances to $98,800.

    Some of that increase doesn’t come on the part of American’s putting away more money but is a product of a stock market that continues to march higher. The average 401k contribution rate increased 8.5% during the three months ended in September, which is the highest percentage in nearly ten years. More than one in four savers increased their contribution rate compared to last year, noted Fidelity. As for IRA investors, the amount contributed increased 12%. Fidelity said it saw an increase in its Roth IRA for Kids, which the firm said hit 10,000 accounts during the September ended the quarter.

  36. I admire your guts to say that on ET.
    May I offer advice.
    Think like a sniper, be very very careful, take your time, when you have thought very carefully a well thought out plan, you are mentally prepared, relaxed, then fire off ONE round at the target. If you miss, the target will fire back and possibly hurt you bad.
    Now continue to do this, carefully after much deliberation and care, fire off a round.
    Finally, and only when proficient, arm yourself with several machine guns, sit in the pit and blast the shit outta everything, your high win rate and high reward to risk ratio will bring in a higher kill rate.
  37. IB account - 4%, but didn't trade until Sept.

    Crypto accounts - +500%. HODLing ETH, ADA, and RAIblocks.

    Wait, make that +300%
    Wait, +400%
    Wait back down to 350%

  38. Equity curve of shorter term trades from 2017. 350+ trades, hold time from minutes to 40 days. All Tradestation/Easylanguage coded strategies. All strategies tested from at least 1/1/2007, All used Kelly-style position-sizing. Profit factor: 3.70, 76% profitable. All real-time/ real money. Trades_2017.jpg
  39. Where's the LHS scale?
  40. That's one hell of a PF for that many trades.... well done captain
  41. 55% annualized. Levered in stocks and options. Although I beat the market, my Sharpe ratio was less than the market.
  42. 19%. Worst DD 2%.