May I say...

Discussion in 'Trading' started by heavenskrow, Jan 15, 2016.

  1. Absolutely gigantic shmorc rip up based on nothing for U.S. session Thursday, make me have to cover all my shorts. Then "they" sell it off overnight. THIS IS RIDICULOUS, and I CRY MANIPULATION or a bunch of dumb investors.

    Fuck this charade. They pulled off the same exact bullshit May-July 2015 before the huge selloff in August.

    WHAT A JOKE.
     
  2. Autodidact

    Autodidact

    All technical, learn to read price, sorry but getting tired of watching neophytes claim conspiracy and wrong doing.
     
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  3. Well yeah I saw the price react to resistance for top and start rip on a failed break lower for Thursday.

    However what I don't understand is the huge rip up during day session and then selloff of almost same exact move overnight.
     
  4. Anyways I realize I am getting emotional. Best to take a break. Just very irritated with these huge fake out rips when the real direction is down.
     
  5. Autodidact

    Autodidact

    If you don't want this to happen to you, don't short low, short when the bulls get excited, assuming the downtrend is still healthy.

    Check your "manipulation" on the chart attached, see that? that's where big money is selling, Bears in total control. Bulls can make money too, but for that you need to be highly adept (counter-trend at this point).

    This is very very basic but I will give you a starting point.

    Biggest problem in downtrends is that people short when price is making lower lows, and that's precisely when you should be thinking about taking or trailing for profits, you want to short the LOWER HIGHS, short lower lows and you will most likely take it up the ass because the thing would need to go down vertically for you to make money without taking massive heat, and price very rarely does that; it moves in waves. By shorting low not only do you receive much less reward, but you are asking to take massive heat, learn to short high and learn to buy low (in uptrends), but please, no manipulation theories, it makes you look dumb and act dumb. Until you learn the game, stay out of ranges, they are harder for most. Wait for a well defined trend and try the above, no trend, no trades, don't use MAs, use channels (sometimes wedges, other times broadening formations) and remember that price doesnt have to perfectly hold inside of it, due to volatility and stop runs it can sometimes behave erratic and fake out of these formations a lot creating failed breakouts and screwing breakout traders.

    Anyway, good luck and stay cash or sim until you learn the game.

    Manipulation.png
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2016
  6. Javier

    Javier

    That happened to me much times. I "knew" where the market should go as a logical, but... we are dolls men.
     
  7. wrbtrader

    wrbtrader

    You're able to recognize that this had occurred before but you didn't use that prior occurrence to help you re-enter the trade after you had "to cover all shorts". That prior trade experience (assuming you actually traded when it had occurred before) is a critical aspect of trading that some traders lean heavily on while others underestimate its importance until after the fact.

    This is why I say trading isn't perfect and we must be able to react (adapt) when things don't go our way and that reaction involves re-entering the trade as soon as our price rolls over again to confirm we were right about the original position instead of staying on the sidelines getting pssst that we are not on board.

    Seriously, I've see this happen a lot during the bubble burst. Market doing poorly and some stock moves higher from 80 to 90 and those that were short around 80 were forced to cover around 85 to then they watch the stock drop from 90 to 60...they continue doing nothing or very little except scream manipulation.

    Next, it then drops from 60 to 40 then 40 to 20 and during all those weak counter-thrusts that eventually rolled over again southward...still no re-entering.

    Like you said, this "same exact bullshit" happen before. You should then use that information to your advantage. Oh yeah....it will happen again.
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2016
  8. barcadia

    barcadia

    Be one with the market.
     
  9. Right, I always try to sell on strength(bear) and buy on weakness(bull). However with huge rips higher such as Thursday, I always end up covering my positions...probably because I am staring at the P&L too much. (I realize this weakness-----of mine)

    If you noticed in the past few days, bears will slowly make their move down. The bulls on the other hand, now that I look back on it have been mainly propelled by short covering.(Or actual buyers........but I mean almost every single stock moves)
    The moves are sharp, vicious, and take out the most recent highs. Intraday the bull moves are ridiculous but on a longer time frame, such as the chart you have attached.... paint a different picture on who is in control/

    But overall I agree with your advice, my trading strategy is actually almost exactly like that. The hard part however is sometimes you think to yourself, "hmm the market is smarter than me and must know something....then I tend to rethink my current positions and either take a loss or give back a large profit instead of staying with it.

    Also when the market is ripping, and you keep jabbing at it, on places you think the market will react to, you can take a lot of losses that lead up to a large loss. However this is still my favorite strategy, just need to perfect it.
     
  10. Xela

    Xela


    One thing I'll tell you for sure (unsympathetic though it may sound, and sorry about that!): as long as you look at your trading results in terms of what "they" are doing "to you", i.e. avoiding responsibility for the outcomes of your own decisions, you will not be making a living, this way. The wording of every single sentence of your post makes that clear.

    Your problem is not about what other people are doing to you - it's about your own attitudes and beliefs. I know nobody likes hearing that, but that's the way it is.



    You can say it, but it appears that you're the one screwing yourself over. You can say it as often as you like, in fact, but the market doesn't care, and eventually you're going to have to ask yourself "How's that working out, for me?" instead. It would actually help you more to start from the premise that your trading decisions are losing you money in a market in which some other people's decisions are making them money. (We've all been there, at some point.)
     
    #10     Jan 15, 2016
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