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"Budget" build gone wrong

  1. Bolimomo, scap, help! Lol!

    I'm about to order the following:

    Computer: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16883227328

    Monitors: Six of them) http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16824176141

    Stand: (Something like this for 6) http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=213682

    I was originally going to stick with my Dell T3500, but it's not as fast as what I have at the office. The problem is somedays (if there aren't any appointments), I'd like to trade from home. The problem is I'm used to multi monitors (and speed!) I know some guys here can trade from a laptop, but I just can't. Plus, I do believe that if you are running a slow system, you may be complaining about slippage a little more than someone using a fast one. On the few times I've stayed at home and traded for my own account, I've noticed slippage that's not as prominent with my "speedy" computer at the office. I'm on a T1 there also. At home I'm on a cable modem which I ordered at the highest speed, but wonder about that one at times...

    I thought about it, and I carry my laptop with me when I'm NOT trading, so why have one at home to trade with?:confused:

    Since I blew the budget build on the laptop trading idea:eek: Opinions are appreciated here. I'm at least wanting to stay in the $3,000-$3,200 area turn key for something like the above. Let me know what you think.

    And yes, my Wife will complain about this, so I'm preparing for it now.:eek: :( :D
     
  2. Six monitors??? I thought you have been talking about 2 external monitors on a laptop. All of a sudden, it's 6 monitors? What are you gonna do with so many monitors??? LOL :D

    So... what was your "gone wrong" question?

    Regarding the above box... I don't get it...

    I am a HP guy. So I let scat to fill in the Dell piece. :) I searched HP's shopping site and I found this:

    HP Pavilion HPE h8xt series

    http://www.shopping.hp.com/webapp/s...s/leftnav_intel_processors_intel_2nd_gen_core

    Ready to use box with an i7-2600 3.8 GHz processor, 9 GB RAM, 2 TB HDD, Win 7 Home Premium. At $1119 compared to the $1879 iBUYPOWER box. I don't know what the additional dollars get you. Probably the video card has something to do with it.

    For trading, some low end video cards will do the job. But wait... you need to drive 6 monitors. The HP box only has 1 PCIe X16 slot. You would need a hex-head graphics card. The other box has 2 PCIe X16 slots. Still can't take 3 x dual-head graphics cards.

    You can do a dual-and-dual to support 4 monitors. Or you can do a quad-and-dual to try to support 6 monitors. Good luck getting that configuration to work. I have no experience in that.
     
  3. Doubt if the problem is "slow computer at home"... more likely it's either some software difference or the difference in your internet connection.

    The amount of data a computer can "handle" is at least 1000X what you usually see in a trading environment.

    For 6 monitors, of course you need to get a proper mobo. Dell and HP are comparable in quality and I presume support... Dells, however, are usually several hundred $$ less than HP for the equivalent machine... it's known that both Dell and HP have their workstation mobos made by Foxconn... wouldn't be surprised to learn they both use the exact same mobo in some cases.

    What CPU is running in your T3500?
     
  4. How many video card you put in? for 3 GTX580, you need upgrade your power supply, original 800W is too small.

    also, upgrade your OS to pro or Ultimate.
     
  5. Perhaps not a good choice for your trading.

    1. Has only 2, x16 slots for video cards.

    2. Has HIGH powered video card... multitudes of overkill-ness for trading.

    3. Expensive.

    If you don't want to buy an HP or Dell workstation, ibuypower.com should be an OK place to get everything except video cards at a good price.

    If you custom order one there, you can get one with 3 or 4 x16 slots on the mobo, X58 or P67 chipset... $1100-ish.
     
  6. is all that power necessary for trading?
     
  7. No
     
  8. Getting a turnkey system that can drive 6 monitors is possible, but it's going to cost you, especially if you're interested in one that comes with an i7-2600K.

    If you can build a system from parts then this configuration I put together on NewEgg will do the trick for $1,763 (less shipping and taxes):

    http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=16534345

    No idea how well the iBuyPower machine can overclock since we don't know what motherboard it comes with. But, it's capped somewhay by using 1333 speed ram. This machine comes with DDR3-1866 which will net you a much faster system from jump and can be easily overclocked to 4.5GHz with no risk of instability.

    The GTX580 is overkill and can only drive 2 monitors. This configuration uses a much cheaper dual DVI, fanless HD6750 and the motherboard can support a 4th card if you want to drive 2 additional monitors.

    The video, P/S, case and CPU cooler are spec'd to give you a reasonably quiet & fast computer.
     
  9. I guess the gone wrong part was me thinking I could trade from home, and get it done with a laptop and two monitors. I just can't trade that way. Some guys have no problem doing it. It's about having a "wall" of information that I can read like a book. An ever changing book, but less clicking.

    After thinking about it, and trying to save a grand vs. something that I'm used to at the office, I'd be better off personally going with what I'm most comfortable with.

    Also, I greatly appreciate the advice! I was about to get into an expensive computer that doesn't have enough PCIe x16 slots, and I'm sure the guy on the phone at newegg would (hopefully) have pointed out that I couldn't run 6 monitors with it. I do like hp products, and am open to the idea. Just need one that will run the 6, and be speedy.

    What do you think of the water cooling pcs vs. air cooling? Big difference if I'm going to have several programs running at one time?

    One thing I was looking at that may save me some money is the fact that the monitors I'm considering have height, tilt, etc., adjustment. I was considering setting three on a desk, and if possibly have a Friend of mine who does wood working make a small but sturdy "shelf" that would be positioned behind the 3 desk monitors, and maybe a few + or - inches below the desk monitors so that the shelf isn't an "eyesore," or distracting. Or maybe not. I may just go with what I'm wanting vs. trying to rig up, and be aggrivated with myself... Here's a stand that isn't as expensive as others I'm seeing. What do you think about the price, and is it a pretty good stand? http://www.ergolcd.com/Ergotech-3-Over-3-100-D28-B33-Desk-Stand.html

    I'll make a call about the hp you linked and ask if they have one with more slots so I can run the monitors.

     
  10. I agree.

    I'm going to go with 1000w. Thanks for pointing that out!
     
  11. The TDP of a GTX 580 is about 245w, more if it's overclocked.

    With a 1KW P/S you've only got about 250w left for the CPU, motherboard, HD, etc.

    You really need a 1250-1350w P/S at a minimum for 3 of them and a 1500w is probably a better bet.
     
  12. I agree completely! You and bolimomo have been EXTREMELY helpful when I was putting together my office setup. It was a job ordering all of the parts, and having a local computer builder/repair/genius lol build it. He's good, but when it comes to parts, he doesn't know what traders (serious traders) are looking for. The first cpu I received was defective, and there were other back and forth issues I don't want to get into this time with a from the ground up build. I'd love to be able to do it myself, but time isn't on my side.

    What do you recommend in a built, tested before being shipped, system in your opinion? And thanks!:)
     
  13. Much appreciated! I'll check out the 1500 watt. I'm not a rich guy at all. Lol and hate spending 4x what "average" computer buyers come out of best buy with, but what I'm doing with a computer I take very serious, and am willing to spend a little more now than have problems later.

    What do you recommend for power backup?

    Thanks again!
     
  14. Not really. It just helps me psychologically by knowing that what I'm using is of high quality, very powerful, and a "wall" of information vs. the constant clicking.
     
  15. Thanks bro! And after reading through ms professional, I like that idea! I think it's worth the extra $!

     
  16. Exactly. You're bottlenecked at 2 monitors if you do ANY real trading. 1Reason had it right. In order to trade profitably you need 6 monitors. It sounds funny, but he really has a point. 2-3 monitors won't do if you're looking through multiple TFs
     
  17. trading environment suppose to be as quiet and relaxing as possible given it's rather stressful at times.

    Good luck having that vacuum of a computer next to you 8 hours a day blasting while you are trying to trade.
     
  18. I think maybe you can save that phone call.

    From what I have seen... HP make or others... most ready-made boxes these days only offer 1 PCIe X16 expansion slots. You are lucky if you find two. As if they have everything you need in their design.

    That's what prompted me to build my own box with a motherboard which has 3 PCIe X16 slots (and I regret not choosing one that has more).

    If you must buy one ready-made box to support 6 monitors, you might need to use a hex-head card or look to those outfits which specialized in making trading computers.

    As for the monitors and stand... didn't you plan to buy the hex-monitor stand? Each arm - the joint for the VESA mount - probably has individual tilt/roll adjustment. If so, the tilt/roll adjustment on the monitor itself would be immaterial. IMO no need to buy a monitor because of a tilt feature.

    Because you buy in a bulk of 6, price saving on each can become significant. The latest bulk of monitors I bought was:

    Viewsonic VX2431wm (24 inch LCD monitor)

    when I found that on sales at Fry's at about $160 each (or something like that). They work okay.

    http://www.amazon.com/ViewSonic-VA2...1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1308472258&sr=1-1
     
  19. If you really hate spending more than you have to and you're really serious about what you're using a computer for then would you mind giving us a bit more detail on what you're going to do with it that requires an i7-2600K and 3 GTX 580's?
     
  20. Would be interested to know which one(s) you've found that can do 4x16 as I've only found a few LGA 1366 boards than can do 3x16.
     
  21. The build shops supposedly test the computers before they ship.. and all of the components are effectively "off the shelf"... so any such computer from any build shop should be more alike than different from another.

    If I were in the market for a trading computer today, I'd limit my choices to (1) a "deal" on an appropriate Dell T3500 from their outlet site, and (2) a "built to my configuration" from some place like ibuypower.com.

    $1,100-ish would be the top price I'd pay... except perhaps if I got a STEAL on a Dell they'd miss-priced... which they sometimes do. (There have been times when Dell sold a unit for less than you could buy the CPU from Newegg... I once bought one for $800 when the CPU was >$1,000. My neighbor, with my help of course, got a T3500 with an X5650 CPU for $1,200. The parts were >$1,600.)
     
  22. Reading HARDWARE threads about computers, power supply, x16 cards, cards alone, etc etc etc etc is 99% entertainment.

    Trading monitors do not need all pcie x slots, x1 slots or whatever are all thats needed.

    Power supply bigger and bigger are just marketing tools, is your trading so bad that you are thinking of using the box as ole "SPARKY"? Right, that was the death chair that Florida used to fry bad boys such as Ted Bundy.

    I am a victim of building boxes with overkill built in but thats an old habit, i always went for Hot chicks also,,, HA

    Soon, finally going to order a laptop........DELL? Hell NO, HP, Hell NO, LENOVO T520, HELL YES>>>>>>>

    Buy quality parts, that is all you need to keep in mind. Build a good box, be wise thats all, do your best and in the long run DO NOT blame slips in trading on your box..........always remember, the slowest input to the computer is from you thinking to you hitting the mouse. :eek:

    PS: get a voltmeter, watts or whatever to calculate the power needed, you might be surprised how little actually needed. Horsepower was always a selling point for cars also, the beat goes on.. New version from a Michigan gal.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iv6duOuvmoU&feature=related
     
  23. There is a very limited number of choices in the x1 video card space. None of the ones I'm familiar with can drive two monitors and they're typically more expensive than a PCIx card with equivalent GPU.
     
  24. Stick to the universal card for Financial industry Quadro NVS

    Thats all you need to know about vid cards for trading.. That was my point, LESS IS MORE.

    PNY built those cards for us, why fight their engineers? I personally have a couple 295 on different boxs and a 300 also. They have been sweet to me for years now. Drivers are a snap, universal for all NVS cards. ---DONE---

    http://www.nvidia.com/object/desktop-nvs.html

    CORRECTION: I should have said: all momitors do NOT need x16 slots to perform as needed for trading. Trading is 2D, we do not need HOT, high voltage 3D cards. All the cards i use are passive cooling. Chevk the stats in that NVIDIA post. You see no fans..... and you see SMALL power usage = LESS HEAT, NO noise. (yes the 420 has a fan, but i never use 4 screen cards, they are not worth the money and if one goes out you are down 4 screens. )
     
  25. If you're happy with the NVS series, fine. But, there are higher performing, fanless cards out there that cost much less.

    Here's one:

    http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814121448

    IMHO, I don't see the point in spending nearly twice as much for a card that delivers half the performance.

    But, that's just me...
     
  26. The MSI board has as many restrictions as slots, it's really a non-starter for video.

    The best one I've found was the Asus P6T7 WS SuperComputer:

    http://usa.asus.com/Motherboards/Intel_Socket_1366/P6T7_WS_SuperComputer/

    But, it also can only do 3x16 or 4x8.

    It's the perfect solution for a CUDA workstation though -- A Quadro 6000 for video and 3 C2070 Tesla cards, damn... ;-)
     
  27. But you are missing the finer points of what i described about cards that were designed for the financial Industry. Do you recall that i said buy QUALITY parts? Price is mox-nix, i want reliability, stability. The "DRIVERS" are engineeded for the card to perform in the proper setting.

    You also missed the whole freaking mention of LESS IS MORE. Who the fuck needs a stupid card like you posted to make a shitload of cash? Performance my ass........ LESS IS MORE

    I will not reply again on what fucking card is best for some clown wanting to buy on the cheap.. :p STRAWBERRYCupcakes 31 OUT
     
  28. Thanks for the post! I wish I had an ounce of computer knowledge you guys have. When I was in High School there were NO computers there besides the ONE (dos) in the library. They just weren't cool back then. The www changed all of that though. I went to College a little later than the average guy, and took ZERO computer classes as it wasn't required + I was scared of them then. Hind sight is 20/20...
     
  29. Are you recommending three of these to drive six 24" monitors? http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/A...40466-rg2304-00-20?s=merchant&m=ATVPDKIKX0DER
     
  30. No, the cards were not "designed for the financial industry."

    History
    The Quadro line of GPU cards emerged in an effort at market segmentation by NVIDIA. In introducing Quadro, NVIDIA was able to charge a premium for essentially the same graphics hardware in professional markets, and direct resources to properly serve the needs of those markets. To differentiate their offerings, NVIDIA used driver software and firmware to enable features vital to segments of the workstation market; e.g., high performance anti-aliased lines and two-sided lighting were reserved for the Quadro product. In addition, improved support through a certified driver program was put in place. These features were of little value in the gaming markets that NVIDIA's products already sold to, but prevented high end customers from using the less expensive products.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nvidia_Quadro#History

    The drivers were also not "engineered" for the card. NVidia moved to a Unified Driver Architecture (UDA) over 8 years ago. This is from technical brief written in 2003 on the differences between the Quadro and GeForce line of products, pg 18:

    "One of the most revolutionary and significant benefits offered with NVIDIA’s professional workstation and consumer GPU families is the NVIDIA Unified Driver Architecture (UDA). The UDA lets one set of drivers be used across the entire range of NVIDIA products including consumer and workstation products."
    http://www.nvidia.com/object/quadro_geforce.html

    As for financial software, here's a link to the certified driver listing, not a single financial application is listed:
    http://www.nvidia.com/page/partner_certified_drivers.html

    Here's a list of their application software partners, again, not a single financial application vendor is listed:
    http://www.nvidia.com/object/workstation_software_partners.html

    When it comes to the NVS line specifically there are two features, Mosaic and nView. Neither of them are specific to financial applications. The bezel correction in Mosaic is pointless for trading and I doubt that many traders are using the virtual screens that nView provides either.
    http://www.nvidia.com/object/desktop-nvs.html

    Fact of the matter is that the NVS series of cards use GPUs that have been around for several years. The G98, which is in the 295 and 400 series cards first appeared in the 8300GS in mid '07 while the GT218 that's in the "new" NVS 300 first appeared in the G200 back in late '09.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Nvidia_graphics_processing_units

    All you're getting for the extra money you've spent is the same drivers that run on dated, underperforming hardware...
     
  31. I'm now lost.:(

    Back to the drawing board for me after going through this thread. I had built an 8 monitor setup with the advice of bolimomo, scat, and a few others literally from the components they pointed out. The guy who built it, did it in front of me on a Saturday, and it was pretty cool seeing how a guy who worked for dell at one time installing componets on the line, a former "geek squad" team leader for four years (kinda funny as he rides Harleys, and looks like it. Lol), and a full time internet cafe owner/repair/builder guy put together the parts for my office setup. He's not cheap, but the work is stunning.

    I was just wanting to go cheaper this time since it's a home setup, and a long time mentor/Friend told me I would be nuts to go from what I'm in front of Monday-Friday to a "completely foreign" setup. I have to agree. This is something I take very seriously vs. something I may go a little cheaper on like a car, new television, etc.,

    I can pull off what I'm used to doing on 8 monitors Mon-Fri with six 24" (1920x1200 are what I'm wanting) monitors at home, on the days I stay home with no appointments.

    I was wondering why this time I was having a harder time pulling the trigger on what I need to get the job done? Guess I've made this thread too complicated, as the last time I simply wrote down the parts recommended, called newegg, etc., and ordered the pieces. i.e., kept it simple. I apologize for not keeping it simple, and to the point earlier.

    Here's what I've deciding to do. My Harley-riding, "computer builder/guru" can build what I need. I had good luck the last time (minus a few back and forth shipments due to two faulty pieces:( ), but overall, it worked out well. If you guys would give me advice on each piece you would order (basically creating a turnkey setup) that will drive six 24" 1920x1200 monitors that is lower on the noise end, is very fast, and reliable, I'd GREATLY appreciate it!:)

    I'm wanting to cool with liquid, and run an i7-2600cpu, a 1200-1500 power supply, 8gb ram, ssd, 1TB, good power backup, the best cards for running six 2 dimentional monitors (I don't need 3d as I don't do any gaming), etc., basically everything you would recommend as I can take care of ordering the monitors, cables, and monitor stand. This will be a "from the case up" build for me.

    Tall task, and I'll really appreciate all of your thoughts and recommendations! Guess this could be a build you could do without having to spend any money, but getting feedback on the results as I post them. I'm planning on taking pics of the build, and posting them in a "six monitor" or something like that build thread as a way to pay you guys back for the advice. My computer builder said he didn't mind that at all, as he wants to put the pics I take on his site (for advertising, of course.)

    I look forward to the opinions and recommendations:)
     
  32. You don't need water cooling for an i7-2600K and I already gave you a link to a configuration that will give you want you asked for, you just need to have someone build it for you.
     
  33. I didn't know that. I was wanting to make sure there were no problems with heat, and had been told that the water cooling setups (when set up with the right stuff), are superior. I appreciate the advice, as that will save me $ if I don't need it.
     
  34. I have 2 tried-and-true configurations which are in use today (model T: over 1 year; model U: about 4 months) with no issues:

    Model T:
    - ASUS P6T motherboard (3 x PCIe X16 slots, can drive 6 monitors with 3 PNY 8400 GS dual-head cards)
    - Intel i7-930 processor
    - 6GB of RAM

    http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=195662&perpage=6&pagenumber=1


    Model U:
    - MSI Bigbang Xpower motherboard (6 x PCIe X16 slots - but only worked with 4 dual-cards without issue, can drive 8 monitors with 4 PNY 8400 GS dual-head cards)
    - Intel i7-950 processor
    - 6GB of RAM

    http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=195662&perpage=6&pagenumber=21


    These are based on the older Intel processors. While they are still valid, it is advisable to get a second generation intel processor (i7-2600k) and a motherboard that supports it to build your new box.

    I too don't think water-cooling is all that necessary. But do recommend buying a good CPU heat sink (about $40 or so) to use in place of the Intel "default" heat sink.


    Maybe like this motherboard?

    MSI Big Bang Marshal P67+Hydra motherboard

    http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/284691-30-bang-marshal-hydra-motherboard


    Advice:

    - Pick the processor
    - Pick the motherboard (note the number of PCIe X16 slots needed)

    the rest can easily fall into play.
     
  35. If you were using a 135w first generation i7 along with 3 high-end video cards, then yes, water cooling would be the way to go.

    But, the 2600K at 95w is about 30% cooler. It also manages the cores dynamically, so it will use even less power and generate less heat as a result.

    The video cards are fanless and will draw around 75w when pushed hard. For what you're planning to do they should only draw 40w max.

    Because of that you won't need a 1200w PS, the 850w will do fine and will not generate a lot of noise or heat.

    I've added 4 Noctua fans to the configuration and swapped the Thermalright heatsink for a Noctua D14. Swap out the fans that come with the case and add two more to the front and you will have a very quiet running computer.

    http://secure.newegg.com/WishList/PublicWishDetail.aspx?WishListNumber=16534345
     
  36. Good deal on Dell T3500 w/W3690 CPU.... (W3690 is current top dog in performance)

    $1219 at Dell outlet. CPU alone is $1085 at Newegg.
     
  37. WOW! That sounds like a deal on a dell. (I made a funny)
    Where did you find this? I've looked around everywhere are the only ones I'm finding are the $3,000+ 3500's with the w3690.
     
  38. At the Dell Outlet site.. just checked, still there.

    If I needed a computer, I'd buy it myself.
     
  39. Outlet or not outlet... have you finalized your video requirements? Still 6 monitors?

    Per T3500 specs sheet:

    =====
    Video Card
    Support for 2 PCI Express x16 Gen 2 graphics cards up to 150 watts (total) including:
    (.....)
    All graphics cards support dual monitor configurations.
    =====

    Have you figured out what video cards to use?
     
  40. Hey bro,

    Looks like two of these since there are only two x16 slots: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B001RBE7GO/ref=nosim/7240466-rg2304-00-20?s=merchant

    The thing that scares me is as stated above, if one of these cards goes bad, I'm down 4 monitors. Btw, with this setup, 8 monitors. It's what I use at work, and I found some cheap stands that will work well.

    The cards, passive cooling, no fan = less noise. I ran into a broker who set up a 12 monitor (22"s) system, and took the elevator down to his floor this afternoon. I liked the setup, but his machine was LOUD! It would drive me insane. He's running cards with fans, and I don't know if it was the combination of the cards, cooling fan, power supply, but that thing was loud!

    I'm wanting to put together something that isn't going to "lul" me to sleep with that low roar (white noise almost?), or something that's going to be so loud, I can't stand to be in the room with it. Do I have a quandry with this?

    I'd like to run a power supply that's around 850-1000w, liquid cooling if it's quieter, the i7-2600, 1tb, solid state drive, etc.,
     
  41. Btw, the broker with the 12 monitor setup isn't really using them for much from what I could tell. He said he liked them as "they impress prospective clients."

    I had to laugh about that one later.:D
     
  42. Or perhaps a loose screw somewhere... LOL :D


    Now that really is a "budget" build gone wrong! :D

    I think you will be okay with a PS around 700W-800W. Especially with the i7-2600k instead of i7-930/950. Liquid cooling probably is not needed. Remember more components = more potential points of failure.

    The quad-head cards are not cheap. $500 for 4 heads = $125 per head on average. The video cards that I have been using are about $50 for dual head = $25 per head.

    Another route is get 2 x dual-head cards for the 2 PCIe X16 slots. Then drive another 2 monitors through 2 x USB-to-DVI set up. Not a preferred route but should work okay. (That's how I drive the 7th and 8th mon on one of mine). $50 + $50 + $80 + $80 instead of $500 x 2.
     
  43. Yes, that guy spent too much. Plus, the damn thing is so loud, I couldn't handle it myself.

    And I agree. I'll try the usb to dvi for two monitors vs spending a grand for two cards.

    Btw, why doesn't newegg have many pre-built gaming/trading computers with more x16 slots? I don't get it.
     
  44. All a matter of demand. Perhaps trading and extreme gaming are the only apps that would use 6+ monitors on a single computer?
     
  45. 05-18-11 12:34 PM

    Winston TJ

    has a dell for sale, just get another card :)



    selling a dell precision 690 dual xeon x5140 with 6GB ddr2 RAM and Matrox G450 Quad card (or can substitute NVS290).

    Windows 7 professional, 64-bit OS

    Office 2007 Professional

    Also have XP64 or XP-32 media that you can downgrade to if you so desire.

    Machine has two dual-core CPUs so it is essentially a single quad-core without hyper threadding. It has two 80GB HDD in a mirror for a boot drive. Machine comes with a 3rd 80GB HDD as a spare. I have tons of HDD so I can add more capacity but HDD are cheap so that may be best for the buyer to do.

    I am in NYC, do yourself a favor and lookup shipping prices. This thing is big, heavy and you can't insure it without the proper OEM packaging (which I don't have) or unless you pay FedEx/UPS to pack which is expensive. Figure $100 to ship insured, maybe more depending on where you are. Located in 10006 zip code.



    Its the bigger one - this is a full-sized workstation tower. It may not fit under some desks and it is very heavy.

    I am no longer using this and I have to pay electricity so it sits idle and collects dust. $350 picked up in NYC (wall st. area) and its yours.:confused:
     
  46. Hey! You watching?

    Dell Outlet has a T3500 w/Xeon W3530 CPU for $759. They also have THREE with W3690 CPU for $1169-$1219.

    Then get 3, Nvidia Quadro NVS 295 video cards (no fans)... 2, x16s, and 1, x1 to run from an x8 slot.

    Powerful. Quiet. Low cost.

    If you don't want to do that, have ibuypower.com build you one for about $1100.

    Or, we'll have Boli chime in with his rec.
     
  47. Oops... one of the W3690s has been sold... better hurry... these are a good deal so shouldn't last long.
     
  48. Oops... 2nd one gone... only 1 left!
     
  49. Oops... all gone. Did you get one of them LEAP?
     
  50. just came home. I was traveling today within the state, and didn't get a chance to check the site. Kills me!:(
     
  51. I'll have my eyes open this week for one of the Dells. Btw, are these reburbished? They're selling a $1,080 CPU in a turn key (almost turn key. I'll be buying the cards), for less than $1,200. Pretty shocking vs. the other stuff out there.

    I don't mind a refurbished Dell, but hopefully they'll offer a warranty, or even a 3yr warranty I may purchase.

    After having some occasional issues with the office setup I ordered the pieces for (literally pieces), and had a really good computer guy build it for me + set it up, I've started reading the fine print of a warranty, and may buy one. The computer guru I know is NOT cheap.:eek:
     
  52. Computers from Dell Outlet may be "refurbished"... may be sold through Outlet for about a half dozen other reasons. All Outlet computers come with same warranty as new.. 3-years.

    What? You bought parts to have a "not cheap" guru build it for you? Have you learned nothing about hardware on ET, Grasshopper?
     
  53. You're right. I got what I paid for. He may have been more $$ than the "average" computer guru, but he did a tremendous job. With money on the line, and this being my job, cutting corners won't work.
     
  54. They are legally required to be labeled "refurbished" if some one returns one for whatever reason. They are simply not new as in a never opened box. Dell checks them out before placing them back on the market.
     
  55. Speaking of warranties, check out what this guy has to say: http://eztradingcomputers.com/tech-support-warranty/

    He's not a fan of Dell or HP from his earlier video clips. Why? He sells computers. Lol!

    Just wanted to know what you think of what he points out about warranties, and if he's FOS or not.
     
  56. Only partially correct.

    Some of them ARE NEW.. as in "never opened box". Some business might order 25 computers, but when it's time to take delivery, they only take 15. The other 10 go onto outlet.

    (I once talked to support at Dell about the outlet. They said there are about a half dozen reasons a computer might end up on outlet.)

    If you get "full warranty and service", what difference does it make if it comes through the outlet site rather than retail? Other than the $400-ish or more savings, that is.

    I bought my first Dell from the retail site. All others have been from outlet... going back 10 years, now.
     
  57. "Cutting corners won't work"?

    Do you know the odds of your having a computer failure are GREATER in a custom built rig than a workstation from a place like Dell, HP, or Lenovo who sell hundreds of thousands of the same unit?
     
  58. Agree with you, if they have what you're looking for you can't beat the deals. It's not even worth the effort to try.
     
  59. Sometimes they have deals that are so good you end up with more than you were looking for.

    In the last week, Outlet had 5, T3500s with Xeon W3690 CPU (current #1 performance CPU.. Passmark) for $1169-$1219. Those were excellent deals considering Newegg sells the W3690 CPU alone for $1085. On one day, Outlet had 3 of them. From the time I noticed, they were gone in 11 minutes.)
     
  60. Leapup did you buy a new computer yet ?
     
  61. Ok, ok, you've sold me.:D

    I'll be buying one of the T3500's w/ the 3690 CPU. Sounds like my home setup will be more reliable than what I have at the office.

    Thanks again for the advice! You guys know your stuff!
     
  62. I wasn't trying to "sell" you on the T3500... just mentioning that in no way is the T3500 at a good price, "cutting corners". With a W3690, should be a ROCKET... and if you get it for about $500 less than the cost of parts if you BIY, hard to find fault with such a deal.

    Though the T3500s are good, their mobos were early in the X58 cycle. They don't have the latest USB 3.0 nor SATA III... those features can be added via a PCIEx4 card, if you wish.
     
  63. Again, I appreciate the advice! Btw, is this the one you're talking about? http://outlet.us.dell.com/ARBOnline...px?c=us&cs=28&l=en&s=dfb&brandid=2803&fid=984

    Nevermind. I missed it by minutes. It's not there when I refreshed the page. Damn!:(
     
  64. It's almost hit or miss with these desktops. I haven't called Dell, but wonder if they would take my cc/debit card #, and process the transaction as soon as they get another one with the 3690?

    Btw scat, if I run eight 22' monitors (I have eight 24s at work, and literally have to slide my chair back and forth at times which is a little aggrivating), are there enough 16 slots for the 290 or 300 cards to run eight? I hate to move up to the $500 cards that run four monitors as they have the fans that I KNOW will drive me batty, or put me to sleep. Noise is a MAJOR issue for me. Some guys have no problem with the noise, but I can't handle it.:(
     
  65. NVS 290 and 300 are dual-head cards. To support 8 monitors you need to have 4 of them. Thus 4 x PCIe X16 slots on the box. You are back to the original dilemma.
     
  66. 1. T3500s have 2, x16 and 2, x8 slots. You could run NVS 295 x1s in the x8 slots. If you want 4, x16 slots... you're probably stuck with having a rig built with a gamer mobo or one of those 6, x16 jobs like Boli has.

    2. NVS 450 cards (quad port) do not have fans.

    3. I doubt Dell would process the transaction in the manner you describe. Besides, one might come up with 24G of RAM which they have included in the price at about $600, and/or a $1500, video card and you wouldn't want that.

    4. You might want to consider running your monitors in portrait mode to cut down on the side-to-side whiplash. Unless you have IPS panels, the viewing angle on the peripheral monitors might be a bit of a problem however.
     
  67. I just received a 15% coupon from dell outlet business, that brought the price down to $1036.00. Unlike others here I didn't think I needed anything near that powerful but considering the good deal and that I it seems my hardware lasts forever, I bought one. Thanks scat and others for all the info on this.

    This was for the w3690.
     
  68. I missed it. Again...:(

    And after calling Dell, no, they won't debit my cc/debit card when one comes available. It's almost like I've gotta run around with an ipad or laptop constantly refreshing the t3500 area during the day to get one if I'm out of the office.
     
  69. Yes, and I'm not paying $500+ for the cards to run 8. What's the solution? You and Scat know more about this than I do. The last time (for my office), I wrote down what you guys recommended, called newegg to order the parts, called around for monitor stands, etc., and had a "guru" (expensive one) build it. By the time it was said and done, I had close to $4,900 in the setup. I'm not complaining as it's fast and gets the job done.

    I was originally going to do a "budget" build (3 monitors) for my home, but don't want to deviate too far from what I'm used to. I can get away with six, no problem, but I can get quad monitor stands at a price that basically allows me to run 8 for the price of 6.

    What a quandry.
    :( :confused: :D
     
  70. Really? Does that $4900 include 8 monitors and the monitor stand?

    I remember buying parts came up to around $1200 - $1300 or so. With Windows OS add another $200.

    You know that if you buy the parts from Fry's (and I checked... they have stores in New York), you can have them assemble the parts to build a computer and test it and load the OS for you, for about $100. Right?
     
  71. $4900 for a trading rig? Sorry, man, you HOSED yourself. We keep saying that a trading computer (not including monitors or stands) should be $1100-$1200.. TOPS. And you can do just fine for a lot less. I've highlighted the board sometimes when there were good deals on trading rigs at Dell Outlet... some for a cheap as $569.
     
  72. You're not checking often enough. That one was available for > 48 hrs.
     
  73. LEAPup are you signed up to receive coupons from Dell outlet ? I received a coupon for 15% off on laptop or desktop from the outlet. That brought the price on the rig y'all are talking about down to $1036. I bought one yesterday morning at that price.
     
  74. Lots of people know about the sometimes great deals on Dell Outlet and are looking for them.

    On no less than 4 separate occasions I've clicked to "add to cart" and received the message, "sorry no longer available"... that is, somebody beat me to the punch by seconds.

    "Good" deals will sometimes stay around for a couple of days. "Great" deals.. perhaps only hours or minutes.
     
  75. Yes, that was turn key.
     
  76. I'm going to check in more often. I'm sure I'll find one. And yes, I was past "add to cart" when I received the same message on the one I wanted.
     
  77. there used to be "tricks" to get better price when buying from dell outlet
     
  78. That was for everything turn key, 8 monitors, stands, cables, power backup, the guy to build it, set it up, etc., Still wasn't cheap by any means though.:(
     
  79. Sounds about right... I myself looked at the Tommy Grisafi bundle (known for his killer trading room basement if you've never heard of him) from Falcon but ended up going with another vendor's system and buying the remaining components separately because Linux was not supported with this vendor. With our chosen profession an extra thousand or two more for a faster/better machine should not even be noticed or made an issue. Also, running four or more monitors in a matrix display per system is always going to add 1K or more to the system price.

    It is true that actual trading does not require an extreme configuration but backtesting/simulation or running multiple trading platforms and activities could certainly justify it. I could think of worse areas to waste money but buying a faster/better computer would not be one of them.

    http://www.tradingcomputers.com/TC_TomGrisafi.html

    edit:

    Grisafi basement on BBC

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqoM3ktuAf4
     


  80. This cards from AMD cost a little less than $250/per...Still looking at closer to $500 for two/8 monitors...

    My Quadro NVS 440 works great, but pricier...paid closer to $450 for one card (running 4 24" DELL P2411H).


    http://shop.amd.com/US/_layouts/sho...tby=price_ascending&filter=model:FirePro+2460
     
  81. I think we had read it wrong, Scat. $4900 is all inclusive for his turn-key system.

    8 monitors, can be as high as $300 each = $2400
    1 monitor stand, can be $500 to $700. that's $3100

    The remaining $1800 would be for the box's hardware, OS, video cards and the expert labor to put them together.
     
  82. The monitor stand should not be nearly that expensive. I got this quad stand for $100 and it is very solid and good quality. Even paying $200 per stand is pricey when these are available.


    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B001HHNRFK
     
  83. That's the way to buy stands... enough for 8 mon = $75
     
  84. Perhaps not "HOSED"... maybe just "hosed".
     
  85. I paid too much for the Ergotron quad monitor stands. Both together were about $700.

    I will say, however, that they're so sturdy I can sleep at night knowing I'm going to come to the office the next day, and not have four (or all 8:eek: ) monitors laying on their face broken.
     
  86. THAT is a cheap price! Btw, did any of you scroll down through the comments by other buyers, and click on the youtube link of the guy with the 6 monitor setup? These stands look to take up a good bit of desk space, but as long as they're sturdy, I'd be interested.

    Btw, did anyone notice the ashtray overflowing with cig butts, and the roll of toilet paper on the desk?:confused: :D
     
  87. Is that "hosed" akin to being sprayed down with a fire hose, or being hosed as in a jailhouse "love scene?":eek: :D
     
  88. Danged if I know... could even be as in "beaten with a rubber hose"..
     
  89. I just received the refurbished 3500 from Dell outlet, I don't know who had it before but it looks brand new, not a mark on it. Now looking up on line how to add the memory.
     
  90. LOL!:D Probably so...
     
  91. Picked off a T3500 w/W3530 CPU for $629 from Dell Outlet. Not the best deal I ever got from them, but still about "$300 less than parts"... going to run XP on it, too.

    (This is the kind of computer you noobs should be buying for a trading rig.)

    :D
     
  92. Haven't you gotten enough boxes already??? :D Is this your Dell #7 or something? :)
     
  93. Sadly, I've had waaayy more than that. I cycle out some of my old stuff to keep things reasonably current. And this one has about twice the horsepower of the one it will replace.
     
  94. Only twice? I thought we would shoot for 10x. LOL :D

    I envy the i7-2600k. Only 1 year and made obsolete my i7-930 by 2x. I wonder what the Intel third generation would be like.
     
  95. I could have bought one with Xeon W3690 for an additional $600... and that would have been a good deal too... but I'd never get to use all that power.
     
  96. Sorry to hijack the thread, but I was wondering if could ask for some feedback. What would you consider a better computer, the Dell t3500 or the HP h8xt?

    By, the way just saw the t3500 gets a $500 discount when the workstation prices at $1499 or more.

    Thanks for any input.