I certainly hope not, becoz prop trading is radically different from those bucket shops trading in commodities in 1990s. The key difference is, we dun have to come up with huge amount of capital, and losses absorbed by company. Secondly, traders are in full control of their own trades.
Lets hope other prop firms that follow into Singapore do not damage the prop trading line. Every industry has its bad sheep. U know, too many cooks spoilt the soup...
Best Rgds
Are there even enough traders for prop firm to survive?
All the retail traders I know have day job or trading casually once a day.
Singapore, being the "kiasu" place it is, has few people looking to be a full time trader.
Even those from Poly/Uni finance courses who have the "dream" of becoming a trader one day is looking at being remisers or Locals.
Our people just have no guts to do it on their own.
They "die die" need people to hold their hands.
unless the payout is good then more ppl will join..else they would be better off working day earning lesser. singaporean need to see $$$$ before they commit. no money cannot survive here in singapore.... haha.
but hope there will be a successful Prop Firm establish here..
Are there even enough traders for prop firm to survive?
All the retail traders I know have day job or trading casually once a day.
Singapore, being the "kiasu" place it is, has few people looking to be a full time trader.
Even those from Poly/Uni finance courses who have the "dream" of becoming a trader one day is looking at being remisers or Locals.
Our people just have no guts to do it on their own.
They "die die" need people to hold their hands.
Hi Remiraz!
Thats an excellent question from u! Being a trader is no difference from being your own boss. I personally think setting up and running own business is much more difficult than being a trader though. Have to take care of overheads, employees, sales, suppliers, etc. Traders have none of these worries. Most fresh grads took the path of remisers/dealers to gain experience, that's fine. But most will juz get stuck in their line once they used to it. Few willing to move out of their comfort zone. Singaporeans tend to favours jobs with basic pay, I can't blame them. Cost of living simply too high.
Can prop firms survive? Well, I can't answer u that. A lot depends on the financial power of the founders, and also how excellent traders are there. Prop firms have strict risk mgt system, so I guess that's one of the key to their survivals too.
SGX is so extremely risk averse, still living in fear of another Nick Leeson. I will be shocked if prop gains a real foothold there. The derivatives exchange is still operating in the stone age and the omnipotent regulators don't give a damn for anything except CYA, despite the nonsense they put out in the press.
And who wants to trade Nasdaq/NYSE day in and day out from Singapore - the hours are Sh*t.
Any prop firm incurs the smallest infraction and they will be gone, likely with all the employees with professional sanctions on their record to boot. Just seems much more logical to base the firm somewhere else. KL is close, as is HK, Taipei. I would bet the China prop market will become extremely lucrative over time, but few western firms will have the resources and fortitude to establish a presence. For prop, Singapore is just not worth it IMO.
Hopefully prop trading firms will establish a foothold in Singapore – this applies to both stocks and futures trading. It is common knowledge that SGX is pushing to migrate all their products to an all screen environment within a year. Their flagship contract Eurodollar futures (not the currency) has seen virtually all of its volume revert to CME’s GLOBEX platform. The great hope for Singapore derivatives trading is for an electronic Nikkei 225 contract to take on the mighty Osaka…
Prop trading really means that in-house traders are backed and trained by the firm. In addition to a percentage of any profits the firm will take overrides on commissions, desk fees, interest costs and other admin fees. They hope that out of every batch of young starry eyed youngsters, a superstar will emerge.
Unfortunately in Singapore, most of the futures clearers have not the patience, fortitude or skilled personnel to develop profitable teams. In a nutshell the firms are unwilling to make the capital investment in good infrastructure nor have the patience to develop such teams (2 yrs plus.)
Contrast this to Chicago, where prop shops are a dime a dozen. Are the American traders functionally any more different than Singaporeans – no not really? As a foreigner I have had the opportunity to work on SGX for a few years and personally know some of the biggest traders on the floor. They are gutsy, real risk takers and most importantly people of integrity; surely comparable to any of the top Chicago traders. I also speak for some the order fillers when I make this comparison.
Unfortunately the floor will no longer exist so such comparisons become moot. The future of the Singapore market is with the young, aggressive, western thinking graduates. They don’t have any baggage or preconceptions (unlike us old dogs!!) about electronic trading.
Singapore has a long history of futures trading going back to 1982 (When SIMEX was formed.) I hope that high quality prop trading firms can recognize the opportunity and begin to train the new generation.
Hopefully prop trading firms will establish a foothold in Singapore – this applies to both stocks and futures trading. It is common knowledge that SGX is pushing to migrate all their products to an all screen environment within a year. Their flagship contract Eurodollar futures (not the currency) has seen virtually all of its volume revert to CME’s GLOBEX platform. The great hope for Singapore derivatives trading is for an electronic Nikkei 225 contract to take on the mighty Osaka…
Prop trading really means that in-house traders are backed and trained by the firm. In addition to a percentage of any profits the firm will take overrides on commissions, desk fees, interest costs and other admin fees. They hope that out of every batch of young starry eyed youngsters, a superstar will emerge.
Unfortunately in Singapore, most of the futures clearers have not the patience, fortitude or skilled personnel to develop profitable teams. In a nutshell the firms are unwilling to make the capital investment in good infrastructure nor have the patience to develop such teams (2 yrs plus.)
Contrast this to Chicago, where prop shops are a dime a dozen. Are the American traders functionally any more different than Singaporeans – no not really? As a foreigner I have had the opportunity to work on SGX for a few years and personally know some of the biggest traders on the floor. They are gutsy, real risk takers and most importantly people of integrity; surely comparable to any of the top Chicago traders. I also speak for some the order fillers when I make this comparison.
Unfortunately the floor will no longer exist so such comparisons become moot. The future of the Singapore market is with the young, aggressive, western thinking graduates. They don’t have any baggage or preconceptions (unlike us old dogs!!) about electronic trading.
Singapore has a long history of futures trading going back to 1982 (When SIMEX was formed.) I hope that high quality prop trading firms can recognize the opportunity and begin to train the new generation.
G.
Hi,
fully agreed open-outcry is gonna phrasing out. The gd old days aare gone. Auction system simply is inefficient, compared with electronic one. Young Singaporeans can be generally classified into 2 major group: 1 grp is contented with having a gd education and work their butts out climbing the corporate ladder. Another grp can take risk, but wanted to see BIG $ FAST, preferrably overnite! They tend not to have the determination and patience too.
A gd trader is not taught overnight. That's the saddest thing.
