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BUTfr
Registered: Apr 2012
Posts: 20 |
05-07-12 07:59 PM
Quote from icarus618:
Offer 80/20 split on the profits, 80% to the trader, and 50/50 split on losses, if any. Prepare to go as high as 90/10 on the profits. Run, don't walk, away if you do not get the 50/50 split on the losses.
Good luck.
50/50 split on the losses? Where did you get that?
Also, 90/10 split on the profit? 90% of the profit to the trader?
Do you have any knowledge of the hedge fund industry at all?
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trading_time
Registered: Mar 2006
Posts: 488 |
05-07-12 08:17 PM
50/50 split on losses? LMAO, That could happen but it would have to be agreed upon.
It is well known the investor takes all of the risk when funding a trader, or a fund with his capital.
The only time I am aware of 50/50 split on losses being automatically accepted is when both parties are putting up capital usually equal amounts.
Quote from icarus618:
Offer 80/20 split on the profits, 80% to the trader, and 50/50 split on losses, if any. Prepare to go as high as 90/10 on the profits. Run, don't walk, away if you do not get the 50/50 split on the losses.
Good luck.
Quote from BUTfr:
50/50 split on the losses? Where did you get that?
Also, 90/10 split on the profit? 90% of the profit to the trader?
Do you have any knowledge of the hedge fund industry at all?
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tivthetrader
Registered: Mar 2002
Posts: 134 |
05-07-12 10:20 PM
i have experience in this situation in all ways. I have been a profitable trader for many years. You can search my name here and some of my old performance records used to get posted by others, not by me.
IRA's are tough to trade in that form, as you are prohibited from going short, or from using any kind of ratio spreads that would make you short. You also are limited to settled funds, so you cant really scalp in there back and forth all day. What you can do is sell covered calls against positions, but again, you can only break the spread one way, as you cant take the position off when you feel its opportune and just leave the juice out there.
The way around this is to go the self directed route and then send the money to the firm trading it for you. Then he is not similarly restricted, as long as the bulk of the money that he is trading is not IRA money. Of course, you run the risk there that the guy is legit as the money leaves your control.
This info is up to date as of a year or so ago which was the last time I took in any IRA money to trade. I think its still accurate but I would check if i were you. Good luck.
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rmorse
Registered: Apr 2011
Posts: 1056 |
05-08-12 01:47 AM
Quote from tivthetrader:
i have experience in this situation in all ways. I have been a profitable trader for many years. You can search my name here and some of my old performance records used to get posted by others, not by me.
IRA's are tough to trade in that form, as you are prohibited from going short, or from using any kind of ratio spreads that would make you short. You also are limited to settled funds, so you cant really scalp in there back and forth all day. What you can do is sell covered calls against positions, but again, you can only break the spread one way, as you cant take the position off when you feel its opportune and just leave the juice out there.
The way around this is to go the self directed route and then send the money to the firm trading it for you. Then he is not similarly restricted, as long as the bulk of the money that he is trading is not IRA money. Of course, you run the risk there that the guy is legit as the money leaves your control.
This info is up to date as of a year or so ago which was the last time I took in any IRA money to trade. I think its still accurate but I would check if i were you. Good luck.
There are some firms out there that specialize in being custodians for IRA's. They allow you to invest your IRA in an LP or hedge fund. Understand two things. Hedge fund trading is not always appropriate for trading retirement money. Also, monies earned from this type of investment might be partially taxable if they use leverage. The portion of the trading income derived from the IRA investment is tax deferred, but the income from the leverage is a taxable event today. It's called, "Unrelated Business Taxable Income."
Bob
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Surdo
Registered: Sep 2005
Posts: 4539 |
05-08-12 02:32 AM
Quote from dealmaker:
The problem with trading IRAs is that you can only go long!
That's what DIREXION funds are for!
You can also trade futures in an IRA.
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icarus618
Registered: Mar 2001
Posts: 987 |
05-08-12 03:20 AM
Quote from BUTfr:
50/50 split on the losses? Where did you get that?
Also, 90/10 split on the profit? 90% of the profit to the trader?
Do you have any knowledge of the hedge fund industry at all?
Quote from trading_time:
50/50 split on losses? LMAO, That could happen but it would have to be agreed upon.
It is well known the investor takes all of the risk when funding a trader, or a fund with his capital.
The only time I am aware of 50/50 split on losses being automatically accepted is when both parties are putting up capital usually equal amounts.
If OP wanted to go the hedge fund route, the information is readily available. He asked what would be a fair deal for a trader to trade his $200K. He can make any deal with anyone he wants. Nothing is "automatically accepted."
Obviously no one serious would consider trading through an IRA under his name. He is looking for someone who is already trading, and it is no big deal to open a partnership account and he can add his $200K to whatever the trader wants to put in. The only question is why would a trader agree to take $200K from a stranger when he has his own liquid funds sitting outside his trading account and people he knows who want in? The short answer is, he wouldn't.
It is laughable to think a trader will take OP's $200K for a hedge-fund type split of 2/20. I may not know much about the hedge fund industry, but the person who thinks that's a fair offer doesn't know any traders.
The problem for OP is that people who are willing to enter into a deal with him are likely not worth giving money to. Loss sharing is an attempt to weed out the wannabes.
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