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wrbtrader
 

Registered: Feb 2010
Posts: 1295

 

12-24-11 12:18 AM


Quote from braincell:

...This december i've seen more automated strats (futures) fail than other months historically. Not mine, but other people's. Maybe the market is really weird for some of the bots right now. Who knows. There's many ways to judge the robustness though. You can look at where the trades are falling within the distribution of the backtest and forward test and if the mean center of gravity starts going weird, or stddev is way off, it's a different problem and a warning.

Switch it off and paper trade it for 20 days, see what it does.



Although I myself do not use automation trading nor mechanical system (I'm discretionary trader)...I do have a handful of personal friends that are automation traders. Most of them have said their systems do not perform well (performs poorly) in December most of the past 10 years.

Further, most of them have stated they do not trade at all in December because of what their backtest have shown them. Simply, December is one big vacation month away from the markets for them.

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western
 

Registered: Mar 2008
Posts: 157

 

12-24-11 12:20 AM

Rather than be upset, you should be extremely thankful your system worked as long as it did.

The market is constantly evolving, your strategies need to as well.

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Bob111
 

Registered: May 2002
Posts: 6406

 

12-24-11 12:26 AM


Quote from wrbtrader:

December is one big vacation month away from the markets for them.



pretty good suggestion and yes, many times this does helps. just take a vacation OR go back to paper trading.to see,how it goes.
or reduce the size by a half or so.

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feng456
 

Registered: May 2010
Posts: 266

 

12-24-11 01:50 AM

I have reduced size because it's gotten to the point where if I don't I will get a margin call. I've been through bad drawdowns before but nothing even close to this. I am currently down 35 points and normally I am down at most 25-30 (which happened once in all my data). Historically I have never been down this much in all the backtesting I've done.

Also historically speaking, December has not been a weak month. In fact, I do not have weak months that repeat annually. It's fairly random.

I am very disciplined as a result of learning from my past mistakes about the alternative but it is really hard to follow your rules when you lose almost every single trade...when you 80-20 win rate turns upside down and suddenly u lose 80 and win only 20.

I designed my leverage under the assumption that the worst drawdown in the backtested 4 years (prior to now) was the worst it could get so now since it's much worse, I am getting wiped out.

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Wide Tailz
 

Registered: Sep 2011
Posts: 1515

 

12-24-11 01:57 AM

Very good thread here.

This illustrates what Intradaybill kept preaching - that you can never, ever know the odds until after the trades are tallied. "Path dependent", he kept saying.

This is where PHd mathematicians claim "the market shouldn't have done that" because it didn't match their model.

Hint: all systems are curve fits of past data.

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Wide Tailz
 

Registered: Sep 2011
Posts: 1515

 

12-24-11 01:59 AM


Quote from feng456:


I am very disciplined as a result of learning from my past mistakes about the alternative but it is really hard to follow your rules when you lose almost every single trade...when you 80-20 win rate turns upside down and suddenly u lose 80 and win only 20.

...I am getting wiped out.



1. bench the system and paper trade it

2. redesign it going further back and test it on out of sample data (sometimes referred to "walk forward" testing)

3. ALL systems are curve fits.......... you can't calculate the future, ever.

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