Forums > Main > Trading > Did Robert Hoffman really lose 312K in a single TF trade? Yikes!

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Old Jul 19th, 2011, 11:14 PM   #1
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 166
Is what I'm reading in the other thread true, that he lost 312K in a single TF trade by averaging heavily into a trade that went against him? If so, I think I just lost whatever ounce of respect I ever had for him as a trader.

The reason I just lost all respect for him as a trader, is because he always pretends to be something he is not, which someone who is concerned about avoiding risk by waiting for the proper setups, etc. The problem is he adds to losing trades with leveraged instruments, so he is someone you should stay away from if you fear losing money!

What I find funny is that I see he has a new video on YouTube where he calmly talks about this as being another learning experience. LMFAO! How about the learning experience being not to play heavily with leveraged instruments the way Robert Hoffman does!

The problem with him is, while he does seem to have a good feel for the market, and seems to present the calm image of someone who is conservative about taking the best setups, his strategy of adding heavily to losing positions will ultimately blow one's account out. It may not happen for a while, but it WILL eventually happen if you trade like hime.

The real lesson is stay away from traders like Robert Hoffman who are playing with fire with heavily leverage instruments. Even though it APPEARED Robert Hoffman could pull it off and take money from the market, even he himself.

His loss IS a learning experience....and the lesson is don't trade like Robert Hoffman. You'll ultimately get your head handed to you, just like he did. His setups likely work most of the time, but all it takes is ONE TIME for a setup to fail when he averages in heavily and BOOM he blows up his account. What a joke! Lesson learned! Stay away from him, except for entertainment! Sorry, Rob, you're probably a nice guy, but I just lost all respect for you as a trader.

ADD: If, by any chance, he's still up for the year from his TRADING (not marketing or subscriptions), then I'll rethink my stance, but I doubt that to be the case.
Old Jul 19th, 2011, 11:23 PM   #2
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Nebraska
Posts: 909
Cutting losses quickly, with emotional detachment is the hallmark of a good trader.

Adding to a losing position only compounds the problem.

Martingales often require deep pockets, and at least strategically timed installments. A loss well into 6 figures gets no sympathy from me.

To quote Paul Tudor Jones: "only losers average losers".
Old Jul 19th, 2011, 11:23 PM   #3
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 6,711
while 312K is not a small loss, it needs to be put in context. my understanding is that this type of loss has not happened to him for at least 2 years. what's his average daily win? did the loss put his account back 1 month, 1 year or 10 years?
Old Jul 19th, 2011, 11:27 PM   #4
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 588
312k seems a lot for one trade but how large is this compared to average loss ?

i think there are these 90% probability of win trades out there where you need to push. Maybe was one of these, in his mind at least. He did not exhaust his account looks like.

If I thought setup gives me 90% chance of win, would probably bet 20-30% of NAV or maybe even more. Assuming not trading small markets.
Old Jul 19th, 2011, 11:28 PM   #5
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 166
I suspect it IS a big setback for him, subscription fees notwithstanding.

Also, I think that people who try to trade like him will lose more frequently than him and blow up their accounts quicker than he does.
Old Jul 19th, 2011, 11:33 PM   #6
Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 314

Apparently he kept adding aggressively to his losing TF (Russell futures) position, until he held more than 800 contracts.

His broker (Infinity) eventually liquidated him.

In the video below Hoffman claims he was adding to a winning position, although others say it was to a loser.
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