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Redneck
 

Registered: Dec 2008
Posts: 2359

 

02-11-10 01:44 AM

It should be noted “the best guru ever” turned out to be a real guru, with his own web site calling out trades – ended up getting tagged by one of his members – then I believe he reregistered under another handle – ce la vie




Now fwiw I have another guru-ism to add – one I’ve seen suggested several times here lately….


Take half a position off once price moves in your direction..

Supposedly doing this helps a newer trader overcome/ counteract the habit of moving a stop too soon (which causes that trader to get stopped out then sit frozen as they watch price move back and scoot off in their original direction)


Nope…… it doesn’t work as advertised – and very possibly could do more harm than good

Yes it is counterintuitive – but then almost everything is counterintuitive when it comes to proper trading.


Please feel free to ignore, discuss, or take me to task…

Respectfully

RN

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codliver
 

Registered: Feb 2010
Posts: 133

 

02-12-10 02:32 PM

redneck so true.........take some off......1/2 is okay.........1/3's is more accepted......but move in ur direction is very vague...let's say es moves 1 pt........1/3 out.........2 pts next 1/3.....ride the rest......point targets must be precise and "when seen"......no slippage concerns or commish etc..that is kkiller........exits must be "when seen" at each target.

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trendo
 

Registered: Aug 2004
Posts: 621

 

02-12-10 03:31 PM


Quote from codliver:

redneck so true.........take some off......1/2 is okay.........1/3's is more accepted......but move in ur direction is very vague...let's say es moves 1 pt........1/3 out.........2 pts next 1/3.....ride the rest......point targets must be precise and "when seen"......no slippage concerns or commish etc..that is kkiller........exits must be "when seen" at each target.


I got the opposite meaning out of Redneck's post. Guru-isms that don't work as advertised. Redneck please clarify.

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Trader666
 

Registered: Sep 2004
Posts: 8151

 

02-12-10 03:51 PM

Can anyone guess who this "guru" is?

1. Seek out locations like ET that are teeming with newbies and wannabees who have a desperate need to believe

2. Troll for followers with grandiose claims, both trading and personal

3. Recruit flunkies and "seconds in command" to support your unsubstantiated claims of trading success... if this is not possible, simply create sock puppets

4. Peddle an incomprehensible "method" with its own jargon that can only can be learned from you or one of your stooges

5. Speak in riddles and gibberish to keep followers hanging on your every word and believing their lack of success is because they didn't grasp the full meaning of your "wisdom." This also makes the "method" nearly impossible to backtest... but if you do mistakenly state something in clear enough terms for others to test, attack backtesting and whoever ran the tests

6. When exposed as a fraud, disappear until it blows over... reappear later in a thread filled with potential fresh victims

7. Constantly berate "detractors" and the "conventional wisdom"

8. Make up success stories about followers who were willing to "do the work" -- even if in reality they went down in flames

9. Never, ever do live trading or show any proof of success (because there is none)

10. Foster a cult-like atmosphere

11. Keep things fresh by promising new things on the horizon that will never materialize, like books and automated trading platforms

12. Find someone to support you so you can play pied piper full time and not be distracted by trivial matters like having to earn a living

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Redneck
 

Registered: Dec 2008
Posts: 2359

 

02-12-10 09:28 PM


Quote from trendo:

I got the opposite meaning out of Redneck's post. Guru-isms that don't work as advertised. Redneck please clarify.




Trendo.

Yes Sir I will… and Yes Sir you are correct about my meaning


A bit of background first

We make the most amount of money by sitting on our hands – either on the sideline because we are not getting a clear read for an entry… or when we’re in a position making money

Obviously if we are in a losing position – we must get the hell out of dodge


Having patience and calmness while trading with deliberation, purpose, and intent – is absolutely paramount for proper trading


Furthermore – having framed up and clearly define trade parameters is also paramount

Specifically why we will get in

Specifically when we will get in

Specifically when and where we be wrong and get out for a loss

And when one gains more experience – where we should be looking to get out with a profit, or at least lock in some profit and reduce our position / exposure a little

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------


Newer traders – lack all the above to one extent or another – and for the most part trade like nervous nellies – which imo is why they move their stops too soon in the first place


By us (the experienced traders???) telling someone to take half off once price moves in your direction – does what – just makes them more nervous and more jumpy/ froggy


Take half off where… when….under what circumstances…

Who knows because we can’t read their mind, we don’t know what they’re trading, we don’t know anything about their methodology…

But I’ve seen this advice being handed out like it’s some sort of miracle cure all… And after thinking on it – imho it actually (subconsciously) causes a trader to become more jumpy and more nervous – because…



By taking half (or whatever) off as soon as price moves in our favor (and I still don’t know exactly what that means) – we are admitting (at least subconsciously) that our position is weak at best.., and/or “will” fail at worst – But the truth is we never know what price will do – so why not sit patiently allow price to show us its intentions.

Also by taking half off I believe a newer trader ends up jumping in / out of positions (racking up commissions), chasing price, and chasing their tail – all of which acts just like a negative feedback loop – so instead of curing the problem – it’s really reinforcing it.


-------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Bottom line;

Every trade we place – we must do so for a specific set of reasons

And by placing a trade – we completely accepted the fact we may lose that money

We know exactly where we will be wrong – hence we have a stop

And once we enter – we must simply sit on our hands and let the play work itself out – win, lose, or draw

Hence we must always trade with patience, calmness, deliberation, intent, and purpose – while remaining within our clearly defined set of parameters – never like some frog in a hot frying pan

And please remember this is for newer traders – experienced traders already have a rhythm and methodology – they can scale it/ out, add to/ take off, fade/ buy... etc.. etc.. etc… because most importantly however they trade…

They absolutely have the patience and calmness – to trade with deliberation, purpose, and intent – while remaining completely within their well defined parameters


Apologies for being such a long winded SOB today

RN

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MarkBrown
 

Registered: Dec 2001
Posts: 989

 

02-12-10 11:12 PM

lurking.....

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