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Old Jan 13th, 2009, 12:44 PM   #67
fhl
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 3,831
[QUOTE]Quote from omegapoint:

Quote:
"

Somebody explain to me where the profit comes from if not from the bagholders? Nothing new is created or am I missing something? Aren't you just substituting one potential purchaser for another for a net unchanged economic stimulus?

I'd be happy to.

For an economy to work efficiently, there needs to be price signals. Price signals allow for capital to be allocated to it's most productive uses. That's one thing speculators do. Provide price signals. If Obama and his team try to tell us where capital should be allocated, we are in for an implosion.

The other thing specs do is provide liquidity so that when price signals give the signal that capital should be moved to a more productive source, it can easily be done. Liquidity is there to do it.

Hope that helps, but I've read some of your posts in p and r, so I know that you will never be convinced.
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Old Jan 13th, 2009, 12:55 PM   #68
1flyfisher
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,113
This is a stupid idea and the idiots proposing this have no clue.

This would destroy financial markets and liquidity and right now in the world we need as much liquidity as we can get.
Trading would halt for more than just the little guys.

I have a Master's in Taxation and have studied Tax Law, spent years in Law libraries, read our Code, Treasury Regs, Court Cases and have seen some ridiculous shit in our code. I hope this doesn't take hold.......But.....
Once this economy turns around Obama is going to Tax the shit out of the wealthy and you can count on BIG CAPITAL GAINS tax increases.
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Old Jan 13th, 2009, 12:59 PM   #69
wjk
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,312
Quote:
Quote from seasideheights:

"Let's be hopeful that some real thought and study is done before this idea takes root in Congress."

Unfortunately, congress is the last place that thought and study will occur.
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Old Jan 13th, 2009, 01:00 PM   #70
gnome
 
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Denver
Posts: 10,007
Quote:
Quote from 1flyfisher:

"... Once this economy turns around Obama is going to Tax the shit out of the wealthy and you can count on BIG CAPITAL GAINS tax increases.
Perhaps there is still hope, then. I think it likely NObama will be out of office by the time the economy "turns around and is healthy" again...
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Old Jan 13th, 2009, 01:02 PM   #71
1flyfisher
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 1,113
Yes, everyone go there and post a well thought out commentary opposing this.



Quote:
Quote from seasideheights:

The author of the NY Times article will think his idea is terrific unless posts against the tax make it into the comments section of that story. Consider doing a quick post there.
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Old Jan 13th, 2009, 01:05 PM   #72
NielsenDK
 
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 93
Quote:
Quote from DmanX:

It wouldn't be taxing profit. They already do that and call it an income tax.

Allegedly, they would tax some value of the transaction - like a sales tax. Problem is, futures contracts have no intrinsic value. They have notational value.

There is no buy and hold strategy with futures as they are wasting "assets."

So, let's say they decided on the notational value upon which to base the tax. Take the E-mini S&P 500...

It's notational value is $50 x the index price. So, if the index were at 1000.00, the notational value would be $50,000.

Tax on that, per side, would be $50,000 x .0025 = $125. Or $250 round turn.
Wow, this better not be going trough, it would be absolutely devastating.
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