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lescor
Registered: Aug 2001
Posts: 2838 |
05-09-10 02:21 PM
Quote from intradaybill:
This does not make any sense. I think the greatest danger to society is the fact that any idiot can claim he is a journalist. Not HFTs.
This journalist did his homework. He's reporting what happened and looking at time and sales, a far cry from perpetuating the fat finger bs that keeps floating around. This is how it really went down.
The reason stuff fell to a penny is because all the algos just turned off. There were literally no bids outside the nyse on some of these stocks.
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d138
Registered: Aug 2008
Posts: 103 |
05-09-10 02:45 PM
I think the following has happened:
1. Fat finger situation on PG.
2. NYSE activates circuit breaker for this ticker.
- However when it halts a trading on a ticker, it continues publishing OLD quotes.
3. As the results NYSE receives a large stream of market sell orders seeking to trade against these faked quotes.
4. It routes them to execute on other markers, thus making it's non-tradable liquidity on the book to look even more attractive and receiving more orders.
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Stock
Registered: Jan 2010
Posts: 39 |
05-09-10 06:12 PM
Regardless of what actually happened, I'm of the opinion that all exchanges should be using the exact same rules as far as circuit breakers and such when participating in the same market(s). That probably would have prevented much of Thursday's carnage.
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IanMacQuaide
Registered: Mar 2007
Posts: 1872 |
05-09-10 06:36 PM
Quote from jeffers_mz:
Two parts to this clusterfuck.
One, the potential energy accumulated by 40+ years trying to borrow our way out of debt set the stage.
Two, numerous (not one, many) kinetic triggers released and channelled that energy destructively.
Of these triggers, at least one is addressable.
Axiom:
If you choose to allow speed of light input to a system, your rules of organization must also execute at the speed of light. Otherwise, the stability and your control of said system is only an illusion.
This makes the most sense of anything I've heard regarding Thursdays "problem".
Another poster ( I can't remember who ) said it IS possible, and he used the term "mathematically possible", for the system to "crash", like it or not.
We all witnessed it.
An old Marine I knew, ( who's gone on to guard the streets of Heaven ), once said "Get all your shit together and put it in one sock!".
We either need a bigger sock, or less shit.
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JMartinez
Registered: Jun 2003
Posts: 439 |
05-09-10 07:11 PM
Quote from ASusilovic:
The pivotal question is : where have been the market makers in this situation ? Even when an ISO cleared through Nasdaq. Why was the next bid at $ 5.54 ? Normally, I would expect a market maker to lick his fingers when Accenture trades at a 20 % discount...I cannot follow any of these "explanations". That's total bulls..t !!!!!!
What's a Market Maker? LOL!!!!
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total_keops
Registered: May 2008
Posts: 1421 |
05-09-10 08:07 PM
It's funny how people can't think, or can't accept that a crash really happened.
1- The SPX is up close to 100% from the lows and the economy is still bad (but slowly improving).
2- The SPX went up in the lsat weeks and may be due for a correction.
3- There are HIGH tensions and uncertainties in Europe and the market is barely down. On CNBC there are images of people in the streets of greece protesting the austerity measures.
So traders are tensed and ready to sell big on any panick.
4- Look at the ES, it was going down, broke and went into a falling knife mode, from 14:42 to 14:45. 60k contracts per minute, high volume but all normal trading. It's a brutal sell off, period.
5- Look at the TY. All day long they went up. On the 14:35 and 14:40 they where goin up and up like there is no tomorow.
6- Look at the USDJPY it started to drop from 14:06 and then some more at 14:44, 14:45 and 14:46. It even had an about 50 ticks free gap.
7- Look at GE, the proxy of inductrial US stocks. Went down in a rainfallup to 14:46. Like the ES, it is a well known pattern. There was even an article in Thechnical Analysis of Stocks and Commodities about how you can code it with the Kalman filter. A trend that going to continue when it starts to slide down and the size of the bars is increasing. It's a sell off on high controled volume. Panick or not, who cares, people are selling and the thing is going south.
8- Dont tell me about bad ticks in ACN. Bad ticks in data happen all day long and the algos are built knowing they can happen.
9- Now look at PG, like any other stock it went down in a controled fashion. Panick selling, stop losses or wathever, people are selling. By 14:45 the stock is about 57 from 63 ish or wathever. AND THEN ONLY AT 14:46 IT WENT ALMOST TOUCHING THE FLOOR. AFTER ALL OTHER PRODUCTS WENT DOWN. SO ISO OR FAT FINGERS ON PG DID NOT CAUSE THE PANICK, NOT EVEN THE NYSE SPECIALIST HALTING TRADING (maybe this coused problems on some stocks but not over the entire market). THE PANICK WAS THERE WAY BEFORE IN THE REAL PRODUCTS (USDJPY AND TY).
Conclusion: there was no glitch, no fat finger, no HFT BS. Just a sweet sell off. It was a real crash. And then I have no clue how it went back up. Maybe the fictious PPT is real and they took the ES up, I dont know. Or they lied to all the planet and said that there was a fat finger or computer glitch and when people eard it on CNBC they bough back and nobody had the nuts or the brain to take a traders look at the charts.
If I made any mistake please correct me. If you think that I am wrong show us the way.
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