Registered: Aug 2009
05-09-12 08:47 AM
Sorry but I could not disagree more. You make it sound like as if markets are static and prices only change infrequently. I am not surprised because after all you and other "retail" brokers make your own markets, so to speak (spikes appear where there never were any, stops are run at levels where the larger market never traded and such forth).
Whatever price feed you provide to your clients, as a matter of fact fx quotes in the general market (general = consolidated price feed that is generated by ECNs or inhouse consolidation engines that encompass many liquidity providers) do change ALL THE TIME, pretty much EVERY second. So, you are arguing that you would have to re-quote each and every single time. Of course that is not the case but you only re-quote when the market goes against your dealing desk, the other times you are more than happy to fill the client's order. Or are you denying that your main broker operations are not taking the other side of your client's order, thus that your interest is directly opposed to the client's interest?
You are blaming latency of data feeds on you re-quoting? Shame on you. Alex, the truth is that you and many other fx "bucket" shops are still trading against clients and make a handsome living off that fact. Some of the bucket shops now offer in addition to their "re-quote, stop hunting" engines a so-called non-dealing desk price feed, where you claim you simply pass along your liquidity provider's prices and fills. That may be true but I argued in length before generally it is the norm that "once bucket shop, always bucket shop" for the following reason: As a matter of fact FXCM and a number others who advertise to offer straight through processing engines do exact that EXCEPT that they now sleep in the same bed with their liquidity providers. Instead of you generating horribly bad/delayed fills, stop-hunts, artificial price spikes at levels where most liquidity never ever traded you now passed that job on to the liquidity providers who happy take over the nest-eggs, and in return partly reimburse you for your generosity through various kickbacks. I am not arguing with you about anything of the above because this is fact and everyone worth his salt and who has traded foreign exchange for several years knows perfectly well about this!!!
Why I still respond to your factually incorrect post is because here is my ADVISE TO NEWBIES OR THOSE WHO WANT TO GET TO AN AS-FAIR-AS-POSSIBLE MARKETPLACE:
-> Trade with brokers who strictly do not take risk and/or positions within the same entity than you are dealing with. NO EXCEPTIONS. Such brokers either maintain an in-house consolidation feed, where they stream the best bid/offers of all their liquidity providers to the client or brokers who offer access to ECNs. It will be well worth a little fortune in following this advise.
A telling sign is that the broker charges commission for executing trades, anything else is a shady business model: Think about it, how else is the broker gonna earn money? Either he charges you a fair commission that you KNOW BEFOREHAND, or he is gonna cheat you out of pips here and there and trust me, that is gonna add up to a multiple to what you pay in commissions.
-> Do not trade with brokers who were numerous times sued by their clients or sanctioned by their regulatory bodies. SIMPLY DO NOT, even if they now "generously" offer a non-dealing desk model. Think about it: Do you trust a convicted rapist who lives in your neighborhood and do you knowingly let your kids play in the direct vicinity. The wrongdoing here is not comparable but please tell me that I am wrong if you do not feel you got raped when your "trusted" broker runs your stop that is 50 pips away from the general market, then argues that this is where the price was for a split second and when you later on try to verify the broker curiously remove the "spike", as if it never existed, in order to rid himself off any evidence.
Attack me as much as you want, Alex, I know you cannot admit the games your firm and other shady brokers play but the above is a fact, DO A SIMPLE GOOGLE SEARCH READ FOR A FEW MINUTES THROUGH THE MANY FILED COMPLAINTS WITH REGULATORY BODIES AGAINST MENTIONED BROKERS, then come back and tell me I lied or made up stories.
What I find hilarious, Alex, is that you dare to tell us how re-quotes are a function of changing prices as if changing prices are a surprise to you. No re-quotes are a function of the price GOING AGAINST YOUR DESK, NOTHING ELSE!!!
Edit: In anticipation of your next post, no need to say "sorry that you had such bad experience with your broker but we do not engage in such practices". Alpari DOES engage in such practices, would you like me to gather numerous posts, sanctions and suits against your firm? Should I start with the sanction issued by the UK FSA in regards to money laundering? Or where else would you like me to start???
Quote from Alpari UK:
Thank you for your reasoned and rationalised argument. It is however absolutely and unequivocally incorrect. Re-quotes have been around ever since the markets were allowed to float. At Alpari UK, we have staff who have been in the market for considerably longer than fifteen years. This was when fx trading was done via telex and phone brokers. When prices changed, re-quotes were given. The idea of a pc per desk was a pipedream at this time.
To avoid re-quotes you can opt for a Direct Market Access (DMA) account. We at Alpari (UK) refer to this as a Pro account. The basic difference here is that prices are not held static (for a few seconds) like non-DMA accounts, they constantly change. Consequently, the fill or kill orders. DMA accounts however do charge a commission (in lieu of spread) for each trade that you place.
To minimize re-quotes on non-DMA accounts:
1. "Enable the maximum deviation for quoted price" checkbox and set it above 10. This implies the max deviation is just 1 pip. To prevent re-quotes during volatile trading times, you may want to set the max deviation between 10 to 40 points (1 to 4 pips).
2. If you use an MT4 indicator to detect spread widening, please make sure that your indicator is configured for the 5 decimal pricing system that we use. Otherwise a 3 pip spread-widening will be shown as 30 pips by the indicator.
3. Another thing to consider is your internet connection to our servers. Test your latency by pinging the Alpari trading servers or just ping alpari.co.uk. If your latency is high (higher ms numbers), then this is one of the factor causing your orders to be re-quoted.
For example, lets say a client is complaining about re-quotes. He gives us an account number and we pull the logs. We find that we received his order at let's say, 9:01:11 and sent the execution back at 9:01:12, so less than a second. He claims it took two minutes and was requoted. Now, his logs showed that the order was placed by him (manually) at 8:59:50. So, yes, assuming all timestamps are correct, that looks like 2 minutes, but we can clearly see that from the time it was received on our end until the time of execution it was barely only a second, hardly a bad time.
Traders in UK and Europe enjoy significantly lower latencies (hence higher speed execution) and experience almost no re-quotes (when maximum deviation setting is correct) than other traders usually in Asia, Australia, Africa or in countries where the internet is routed via proxies such as Saudi Arabia.
I can't really do much for someone that comes on this forum and presents baseless speculation as fact. We want to help. Please let us do so by providing any appropriate information to firstname.lastname@example.org so that we can troubleshoot and address your concerns.
Alpari (UK) Representative