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-- I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years (http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showthread.php?threadid=220513)
I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown. I'm just too demoralized and tired of the stress to continue.
The money I can easily make back but all the time wasted impulsively gambling and all the life wasted from the stress - that I will never regain. No regrets, however - I learned lots about myself and the market. And fortunately, I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
I understand. You've lost your motivation and have become demoralized. Maybe this article in the Atlantic will help you to get some of your motivation back. It's entitled "On the Floor Laughing: Traders Are Having a New Kind of Fun".
I need to find out why, of all the fledgling professionals I know, [my roommate] seems to be the only one genuinely delighted to go into the office every day....
They look less like they're working -- reading e-mails, say, or putting together a slide deck -- than calmly responding to a crisis... It's like a mission control center.
The upshot is that there is a lot of energy on a trading floor. Go to a law firm, Silicon Valley startup, magazine, or corporate headquarters. Even if what they do there shakes the world, even if the staff practically sneezes vibrant creativity, still you can't escape that Office-y undercurrent, the unmistakable intimation of malaise you find wherever adults are stuck inside doing their homework. This place, on the other hand, feels like something closer to an active battleship.
Good luck with your new direction buddy 
Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from thesniper:
I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
I have absolutely zero interest in regaining my motivation to daytrade. I thank God for my protracted drawdown because this is exactly what I needed to quit and to get on the path of true success in this business: managing risk as a portfolio manager.
Here are all the insane huge macro moves I missed the past decade because of being focused on DT:
2001-2003 one of the largest bear markets in history
2003-2008 one of the longest bull markets in history
2001-2011 the most insane bull run in commodities
2008-2009 the most insane volatility ever
Huge moves in FX, dollar getting crushed against all currencies
Huge moves in lots of stocks every year: AAPL, AMZN, GOOG, TZOO, LEH, BP, LULU, NFLX, and way too many stocks to list.
If I were to ride any one of the above multi-year macro trends I'd would have made as much as I did DT with like 1/1000th the effort and 10 times more free time to enjoy life.
Quote from bearlion:
My sincere suggestion is that when the future in uncertain, go for daily trading only and book your profits everyday or every week in stock markets. Do not invest for long term.
Let the owners of giant companies invest their personal money in their company stocks for long term. Example, Bill Gates should sell his assets worth $40 Billion and invest this $40 billion in Microsoft for long term.
Other investors should book their profits every few days.
I book my profits every 2 days or every week. No long term investments. I have sold all my gold and silver.
Quote from thesniper:
[B]I have absolutely zero interest in regaining my motivation to
Here are all the insane huge macro moves I missed the past decade because of being focused on DT:
2001-2003 one of the largest bear markets in history
2003-2008 one of the longest bull markets in history
2001-2011 the most insane bull run in commodities
2008-2009 the most insane volatility ever
Huge moves in FX, dollar getting crushed against all currencies
Huge moves in lots of stocks every year: AAPL, AMZN, GOOG, TZOO, LEH, BP, LULU, NFLX, and way too many stocks to list.
thesniper, you need to take a long break from trading, a good 6-12 months at least. The break will be good for you, it'll let you clear your mind of all the stress that has built up. After taking the long break you can see how you feel about it and decide if you've got the motivation and proper strategy to get back into it. But U definitely need to get away from the business for now, put your mind on something completely different for a while, like maybe a hobby, long vacation, etc. it'll do you alot of good. Good Luck....
Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from thesniper:
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown. I'm just too demoralized and tired of the stress to continue.
The money I can easily make back but all the time wasted impulsively gambling and all the life wasted from the stress - that I will never regain. No regrets, however - I learned lots about myself and the market. And fortunately, I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from Notes123:
You stupid liar. or should I say, a bad liar.
You said: You have traded for 5 years, first 2 years were unprofitable, the last 3 years were profitable, but you are NOW stuck in an 18 month long drawdown.
18 months are 1 and 1/2 years. If you take this time out of the last 3 years, you are left with 1 and 1/2 years of profitable trading.
Where did the 3 years of profitable trading come from?
Idiot.
Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from Notes123:
You said: You have traded for 5 years, first 2 years were unprofitable, the last 3 years were profitable, but you are NOW stuck in an 18 month long drawdown.
18 months are 1 and 1/2 years. If you take this time out of the last 3 years, you are left with 1 and 1/2 years of profitable trading.
Where did the 3 years of profitable trading come from?
I would eneterpret this as "each of the last 3 years was profitable".
Quote from thesniper:
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown.
Quote from thesniper:
I have absolutely zero interest in regaining my motivation to daytrade. I thank God for my protracted drawdown because this is exactly what I needed to quit and to get on the path of true success in this business: managing risk as a portfolio manager.
Here are all the insane huge macro moves I missed the past decade because of being focused on DT:
2001-2003 one of the largest bear markets in history
2003-2008 one of the longest bull markets in history
2001-2011 the most insane bull run in commodities
2008-2009 the most insane volatility ever
Huge moves in FX, dollar getting crushed against all currencies
Huge moves in lots of stocks every year: AAPL, AMZN, GOOG, TZOO, LEH, BP, LULU, NFLX, and way too many stocks to list.
If I were to ride any one of the above multi-year macro trends I'd would have made as much as I did DT with like 1/1000th the effort and 10 times more free time to enjoy life.
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Quote from Notes123:
it's called the hindsight, idiot.
by the way,
2011-2015 will see the biggest collapse of US dollar in history.
2011-2025 will see the longest bear market in history.
2011-2014 will see the biggest increase in gold price, to 4,500 dollars an ounce.
2011-2016 will see the birth of the first great grand child of Osama Bin Laden (a bookie at King's Cross, London, is accepting bets on the gender of the child, place your bet).
you are not very smart, you should quit.
Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from thesniper:
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown. I'm just too demoralized and tired of the stress to continue.
The money I can easily make back but all the time wasted impulsively gambling and all the life wasted from the stress - that I will never regain. No regrets, however - I learned lots about myself and the market. And fortunately, I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
+1
Quote from Magic8:
An idiot, calling another person an idiot.
2011 to 2025... wow! you can predict *14 YEARS* into the future!
Your day, like all others who day trade... is coming. You watch.
Quiting daytrading and stop fighting the robots and at the same time increasing your timeframe is the right step in the evolution of a trader. These are the steps:
1. Beginner: technical day trading, which leads to
2. emotional day trading, which leads to
3. position and swing trading for larger avg. win, which leads to
4. trend following, the method of the masters
Your move proves you are on the right path. I am level 3 now and I hope soon to migrate to level 4.
worrying. I would have thought after 3 years of consistently profitable trading, most would assume that they have finally 'made it' or 'got it', and not have to worry about becoming a losing trader again. So maybe we must be profitable for more like 10 years before we can call ourselves a profitable trader.
Quote from Eddiemorra:
worrying. I would have thought after 3 years of consistently profitable trading, most would assume that they have finally 'made it' or 'got it', and not have to worry about becoming a losing trader again. So maybe we must be profitable for more like 10 years before we can call ourselves a profitable trader.
__________________
Trading is very easy job with automation.
Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from bearlion:
These Profits/Returns Exceeds the Historic Winning Runs
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showt...threadid=219492
__________________
Trading is very easy job with automation.
Quote from bearlion:
My sincere suggestion is that when the future in uncertain, go for daily trading only and book your profits everyday or every week in stock markets. Do not invest for long term.
Anyone who can day trade discretionary (ie not automated) for years on end has my utmost respect.
Day trading is the most intense type of trading there is, you have to be at the top of your game every day.
I cant do it, i automate my day trading rules.
I doubt there are many profitable discretionary day traders on ET, not ones that have lasted for more than 5 years anyway.
The brokers love day traders though. Win or lose, the broker always makes a good profit from day traders.
Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from thesniper:
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown. I'm just too demoralized and tired of the stress to continue.
The money I can easily make back but all the time wasted impulsively gambling and all the life wasted from the stress - that I will never regain. No regrets, however - I learned lots about myself and the market. And fortunately, I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
__________________
More Than 90% of Small Traders Lose. THEY JUST LOSE!!!!!
yeah i think you'll feel better for it. Day rading....self empoyed gambler..what kind of life is that?
You want to create a passive business......Anything that needs you there to make money isn't the way to do it.
Quote from intradaybill:
Quiting daytrading and stop fighting the robots and at the same time increasing your timeframe is the right step in the evolution of a trader. These are the steps:
1. Beginner: technical day trading, which leads to
2. emotional day trading, which leads to
3. position and swing trading for larger avg. win, which leads to
4. trend following, the method of the masters
Your move proves you are on the right path. I am level 3 now and I hope soon to migrate to level 4.
Quote from intradaybill:
Quiting daytrading and stop fighting the robots and at the same time increasing your timeframe is the right step in the evolution of a trader. These are the steps:
1. Beginner: technical day trading, which leads to
2. emotional day trading, which leads to
3. position and swing trading for larger avg. win, which leads to
4. trend following, the method of the masters
Your move proves you are on the right path. I am level 3 now and I hope soon to migrate to level 4.
The reason people fail at day trading is the same reason people fail in life. They have no discipline and expect it to be easy. They aren't willing to put the hard work in and have no game plan.
If you want to learn this game. I suggest you get a mentor as the pit falls are everywhere. Knowing how to avoid them is invaluable.
The steady stream of people who come here and tell anyone willing to listen that it can't be done are wrong. Is it easy, Hell no. Is it possible, Hell yes. They simply weren't cut out for it. Their personalities are more suited to different time frames.
I have been day trading for 12 years. My personality is suited towards it. Sadly, I make a shitty swing trader, as I am not a big fan of overnight risk. Doesn't mean swing trading is a waste of other people's time.
People with rigid opinions (and this site is full of them) aren't likely to succeed in this business on any time frame.
In 2009, I was up 175k up to dec. Then in dec I lost 100k from the HW mark. In 2010 I only made 15k. Anyway I'm not bitter and have no regrets. I'm Happier than ever since I quit. And I'm excited to not waste the next five years of my life as I build up my portfolio management skills. There are tons of jobs for PMs and none for DTs. PM is hugely scaleable whereas DT is not. And I have had lots of people ask me to manage money because they are sick of the negative return on cash for most of the past decade. PM ain't easy bit you can't go wrong buying the fucking dip (BTFD).
Markets already provide investors a 10% return on average per year for doing nothing. So all a skillful BTFD trader has to do is add a few more % to this return by successfully hedging (raising cash) during periods of market turmoil and uncertainty. Any trader that can consistently beat the S&P even by a few points with lower volatility will have an extremely valuable skill that will always be in high demand.
I know why guys DT - they have very little cash and they're trying to make a living off 5-10k of cash and so they have no choice but to DT as a way to aggressively build up the bankroll. This is fine but as soon as you get a couple of hundred k saved to have to stop DT IMO. Then start trading a portfolio of options and futures and build that account and then move on to equities and then OPM. You have to plan decades into the future.
The only DT that are really sucessfull are the MMs - market makers. If you look at red ink and lessor - these guys are MMs basically. They do like 500000 shares a day on 10-20 different stocks and try to net a penny/share over the long run. Most hedge funds that DT trade the same way but which faster tools. So if you want to DT you have to be an MM or forget about it. Trading direction on a single stock or futures contract will never work in the long run. You may make good money but who is gonna pay you for that kind of a limited unscalable skill?
My only regret was trying to trade direction in one stock or in one futures contract at a time instead of being an MM like lescor.
My only advice to DT is: just trade like an MM - that is the classical intraday strategy that's been around a long time. Also once you make good money, learn how to invest because that is a way more valuable, scalable, and marketable skill.
See the ball...BE the ball!
I did custumers 18 to 11 years ago on the side; I swore never again in my life would I ever do that again ... whatever happened to me ... NEVER !
Quote from Magic8:
2011 to 2025... wow! you can predict *14 YEARS* into the future!
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Quote from thesniper:
Markets already provide investors a 10% return on average per year for doing nothing. So all a skillful BTFD trader has to do is add a few more % to this return by successfully hedging (raising cash) during periods of market turmoil and uncertainty. Any trader that can consistently beat the S&P even by a few points with lower volatility will have an extremely valuable skill that will always be in high demand.
I know why guys DT - they have very little cash and they're trying to make a living off 5-10k of cash and so they have no choice but to DT as a way to aggressively build up the bankroll. This is fine but as soon as you get a couple of hundred k saved to have to stop DT IMO. Then start trading a portfolio of options and futures and build that account and then move on to equities and then OPM. You have to plan decades into the future.
The only DT that are really sucessfull are the MMs - market makers. If you look at red ink and lessor - these guys are MMs basically. They do like 500000 shares a day on 10-20 different stocks and try to net a penny/share over the long run. Most hedge funds that DT trade the same way but which faster tools. So if you want to DT you have to be an MM or forget about it. Trading direction on a single stock or futures contract will never work in the long run. You may make good money but who is gonna pay you for that kind of a limited unscalable skill?
My only regret was trying to trade direction in one stock or in one futures contract at a time instead of being an MM like lescor.
My only advice to DT is: just trade like an MM - that is the classical intraday strategy that's been around a long time. Also once you make good money, learn how to invest because that is a way more valuable, scalable, and marketable skill.
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Quote from thesniper:
I know why guys DT - they have very little cash and they're trying to make a living off 5-10k of cash and so they have no choice but to DT as a way to aggressively build up the bankroll. This is fine but as soon as you get a couple of hundred k saved to have to stop DT IMO. Then start trading a portfolio of options and futures and build that account and then move on to equities and then OPM. You have to plan decades into the future.
__________________
Keep it simple.
Quote from Notes123:
Shut up! Don't give advices, because you are clueless.
Jesus, you are full of ignorance and trying to give advices!
Are you going to write a book on trading?
So the natural path is: Losers in trading==>book writers (Van Tharp, Oliver Velez, Mark Douglas, etc.)
are you on drugs ? Stop pulluting this site !
What's the psychology behind a person starting this kind of thread?
Is the OP looking for sympathy?
Does he want to be encouraged to continue to day trade?
Does he want to warn others of the chances for losses in day trading?
What?
Quote from clacy:
Wait, so you know the formula for success?? Why don't you just move to #4 then and become a master?
Quote from BSAM:
What's the psychology behind a person starting this kind of thread?
Is the OP looking for sympathy?
Does he want to be encouraged to continue to day trade?
Does he want to warn others of the chances for losses in day trading?
What?
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Quote from Notes123:
BSAM, good question.
Please allow me to offer my interpreation:
He is trying to poison the mind of day traders, he is working for GS and other institutions, they are losing money to day traders. They hate day traders.
Quote from Notes123:
BSAM, good question.
Please allow me to offer my interpreation:
He is trying to poison the mind of day traders, he is working for GS and other institutions, they are losing money to day traders. They hate day traders.
Sniper, good luck with your future endeavors.
i might have a job for this guy, you come over and papertrade and i'll take the opposite of your trade
__________________
If i had a dollar for everytime someone tried to screw me over...that'd be some major coinage
Quote from oilfxpro:
Day trading is a negative sum game for traders.Trading is a zero sum game.The brokerage industry wants to promote to churn out commissions all day long , at the expense of trader's wealth,health and stupidity.
This threads says it all.
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showt...threadid=218977
Quote from brownsfan019:
What about this thread that is showing a profitable system in your words:
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showt...threadid=111305
Can't decide which side of the fence to get on?
Sir you made an excellent choice, finally. Daytrading is a pipedream.
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showt...light=pipedream
The whole point of this forum is to sell advertising, lie, and political and economic propaganda, stock promotion, sell trading education and lie. In communist countries there is an entire government with billions in annual budget.. the propaganda communications dept. lie. media spinners. why would you want to share information with the enemy?
this isn't a 'private' club.
Quote from Shirak:
Isn't the whole point of a forum to share?
Guys like you make this board ridiculous.
Quote from intradaybill:
Just go to a dojo and ask the master to give you a black belt right away because you know that is where you want to be.
It is not a formula of success. It is a path to success. Try to understand the difference before it is too late for you.
I think 'daytrading' is doable, but of course one Has to have a profitable system
however B&H - Day-to-Days trading only requires say 10 minutes a day when
following a single instrument. a portfolio would require more time but still far, far
less than daytrading, but again, one Has to have a profitable system
the other matter is that some people just aren't suited for daytrading, or any type
of trading for that matter, while some are able to scalp a pip/tick or two profitably
all day long, trade after trade, day after day
I also think that many people getting into trading don't have sufficient perspective to
understand - beforehand - what the consequences of their trading choice may be
'we're here for a good time not a long time' isn't about making money
Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from Notes123:
You stupid liar. or should I say, a bad liar.
Idiot.
Quote from Notes123:
Isn't it my point (hindsight)???
Due to a lack of intelligence, you managed to miss the point completely!
This board is full of idiots!
Day trading? Don't even dream of it, you idiots, you are not the materials.
Only special people succeed in day trading.
Quote from julian0625:
You created a day trading journal called "QM Trading Journal" and openly failed
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Quote from Notes123:
Maybe I am the reason of so many losers coming out of the closet.
These closet losers are thinking: "Notes123 gets on the forum and fails openly, why do I hide in the closet? I am going out and announce my failure too."
There is nothing to be ashamed of in trading, everybody makes mistakes, including blowing up.
Re: Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from flyingdutchmen:
who the fuck do you think you are calling ppl idiots, didnt your mother teach you any manners ? welcome to my ignore list
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Re: Re: Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from Notes123:
Just when I thought I had seen enough idiots in this thread, another one popped up!
You put me on your "ignore list"? Now that will be the end of me, I am really worried.
Idiot! Do I care if I am on your "ignore list"? This is a public forum, nobody knows you, you idiot! You might be a dog or a cat in front of a computer.
note: I will buy you some dog food, if you take me off the "dog's ignore list."
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from jo0477:
for no good reason
__________________
Pay attention to Notes 1 2 3.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from Notes123:
oh, there is a good reason: I am the OP.
now you do understand how stupid you are???
one word describes you: gullible.
One cooks up a story and you idiots all jump in offering condolences. Hilarious.
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
You THINK you cooked up a story, but you are in it :-)
Daytrading is a pipedream.
Quote from Notes123:
One cooks up a story and you idiots all jump in offering condolences. Hilarious.
Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from thesniper:
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown. I'm just too demoralized and tired of the stress to continue.
The money I can easily make back but all the time wasted impulsively gambling and all the life wasted from the stress - that I will never regain. No regrets, however - I learned lots about myself and the market. And fortunately, I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
Re: Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from dalen:
If swing and investing is so much easier and more profitable, why weren't you accomplishing that WHILE day trading. Help smooth out your equity curve. As for the 18 month draw down, surely as a successful day trader with a sound plan you should be able to pick apart why your edge isn't working no more. Make the adjustments (scalable), or reduce size and add more strats suited for this movement. I just don't see how you let it go on for that long.. Best of luck though.
Quote from Red_Ink_inc:
The reason people fail at day trading is the same reason people fail in life. They have no discipline and expect it to be easy. They aren't willing to put the hard work in and have no game plan.
If you want to learn this game. I suggest you get a mentor as the pit falls are everywhere. Knowing how to avoid them is invaluable.
The steady stream of people who come here and tell anyone willing to listen that it can't be done are wrong. Is it easy, Hell no. Is it possible, Hell yes. They simply weren't cut out for it. Their personalities are more suited to different time frames.
I have been day trading for 12 years. My personality is suited towards it. Sadly, I make a shitty swing trader, as I am not a big fan of overnight risk. Doesn't mean swing trading is a waste of other people's time.
People with rigid opinions (and this site is full of them) aren't likely to succeed in this business on any time frame.
__________________
27% of the time im right 100% of the time
Quote from nukethewhales31:
omg you guys crack me the hell up with these guru ass movies
ps. bruce lee got his ass mangled so many times
It funny, when I watch those bruce lee snipets... I am impressed by the delivery, by the act... it was awesome. I want to know who his acting coach and agent and pr coaches were. What I see is an actor, selling his guruishness. His delivery was awesome. It was a beautiful act.
as far as content -- "be water my friend"..... what a bunch of fake zen garbage. Be a rehearsed "IED" my friend would make far more sense.
Bruce Lee was a rehearsed marketing IED, pretending he was being water.
It reminds me of the act all those those other martial arts guy used to get away with until... MMA.
Those guys must have had a martial arts acting school.
course 1. Become proficient at a martial art.
Course 2. How to pretend to be a wise man full of insight
course 3. how to pretend to be a mystic.
course 4, how to be pretend to be a guru.
course 5, how to get create a marketable product and cash in.
Quote from jem:
It reminds me of the act all those those other martial arts guy used to get away with until... MMA.
Those guys must have had a martial arts acting school.
course 1. Become proficient at a martial art.
Course 2. How to pretend to be a wise man full of insight
course 3. how to pretend to be a mystic.
course 4, how to be pretend to be a guru.
course 5, how to get create a marketable product and cash in.
__________________
27% of the time im right 100% of the time
Quote from oilfxpro:
Day trading is a negative sum game for traders.Trading is a zero sum game.The brokerage industry wants to promote to churn out commissions all day long , at the expense of trader's wealth,health and stupidity.
This threads says it all.
http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/showt...threadid=218977
Quote from nukethewhales31:
look very similar to trading school layouts doesnt it.
course1. I will teach you technicals
course2. I will teach you the flow of price
course3. How to trade with determinism and rock hard will
course4. The zen of trading
course5. Unfortunately there are those that will never be able to profit.. but teaching trading can be profitable to use what I have taught you my son.
I can't speak to the flexibility of water when entering and exiting trades... but I can speak to pop zen.
You can't trick yourself into profitable trading for very long.
it takes edge and or experience.
Quote from etile:
You miss the point completely to what Bruce Lee is saying. If anything, Bruce Lee was phrasing Lao Tzu.
"Nothing is softer or more flexible than water, yet nothing can resist it"
Learn to adapt and you will be successful.
__________________
27% of the time im right 100% of the time
Quote from nukethewhales31:
I dont really think that water is that soft.. if I were to belly flop into a pool of water it would hurt more than belly flopping into a pool filled with plush pillows.....and alot of things can resist water.. like a dam
seems like a pointless concept why not just say learn to adapt and you will be successful? cause they wanna sound like gurus.. its about the sell.
__________________
Trading is very easy job with automation.
Re: I finally Quit Daytrading after 5 years
Quote from thesniper:
The first 2 years were unprofitable the last 3 years were profitable but I'm stuck in an 18 month long drawdown. I'm just too demoralized and tired of the stress to continue.
The money I can easily make back but all the time wasted impulsively gambling and all the life wasted from the stress - that I will never regain. No regrets, however - I learned lots about myself and the market. And fortunately, I have more than enough money to make it as a swing trader and investor so I will try that path the reminder of the year.
How can a day trader get stuck in a drawdown? Wouldn't you have exited by 4:00 pm? It sounds like you lost money from swing trading or some type of longer-term trading.
Quote from thunderbolttr:
How can a day trader get stuck in a drawdown? Wouldn't you have exited by 4:00 pm? It sounds like you lost money from swing trading or some type of longer-term trading.
http://doubleyoke.com/2011/04/05/perfect-practice/
Practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect. Talents can be harnessed and developed through perfect practice. The perfect practice is a total of around 10,000 hours of conscious, focused and deliberate efforts.
In “Outliers: The Story of Success”, a well-written and thought-provoking book on success by Malcolm Gladwell in 2008, Gladwell examines the factors that contribute to high levels of success. Throughout the book, he repeatedly mentions the “10,000-Hour Rule”, claiming that the key to success in any field is, to a large extent, a matter of practicing a specific task for a total of around 10,000 hours.
The magic number of 10,000 hours was the average number of hours the pianists, violinists as well as athletes, composers, writers, artists, even criminals spend to achieve their success.
10,000 hours is about 3 hours a day over 10 years.
Give another 5 years!
Quote from d08:
Lose one day, then lose the second day and so on. Drawdown doesn't just magically reset after you close your positions. Read the definition.
The real money was never in daytrading.
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I fought that saying when I was at Schonfeld. I use to argue the point against Victor Neder...and his Spec List Group all the time back then. But right under my very eyes, the key traders that were making serious money (Other than Mr. Rearden) were not day trading, they were building portfolios. Two years later...BAM ASSET MANAGEMENT was formed and Schony became a partner.
As I watched all my friends start to hold positions for months, I still fell into the trap of 'SOES BANDENT ENGERGY' and the "Excitement" of day trading. And my ventures in day trading in Chicago with Schonfeld were more than exciting.
Of course I found an opportunity to jump ship and end up in the PE world having far more fun and success than I did in my ventures of day trading.
There will always be the Few who make money for what ever reasons... But Day Trading seems to be dead except for the few on Elite Trader. The wash out was huge since 08 and the new regs seem to really put the Nail in the whole deal.
Most day traders on ET sound like retired folks who are not trading for a living but trading to supplement their income, which I can understand.
__________________
"Socialism in general has a record of failure so blatant, that only an "intellectual" could ignore or evade it"...Thomas Sowell
Quote from EMRGLOBAL:
The real money was never in daytrading.
Why are people so obsessed about daytrading? Daytrading never worked for me and never will. Very few are good at it. I do much better swing trading and with options.
Good luck to all
Quote from T500K:
http://doubleyoke.com/2011/04/05/perfect-practice/
Practice does not make perfect. Only perfect practice makes perfect. Talents can be harnessed and developed through perfect practice. The perfect practice is a total of around 10,000 hours of conscious, focused and deliberate efforts.
In “Outliers: The Story of Success”, a well-written and thought-provoking book on success by Malcolm Gladwell in 2008, Gladwell examines the factors that contribute to high levels of success. Throughout the book, he repeatedly mentions the “10,000-Hour Rule”, claiming that the key to success in any field is, to a large extent, a matter of practicing a specific task for a total of around 10,000 hours.
The magic number of 10,000 hours was the average number of hours the pianists, violinists as well as athletes, composers, writers, artists, even criminals spend to achieve their success.
10,000 hours is about 3 hours a day over 10 years.
Give another 5 years!
Quote from EMRGLOBAL:
The real money was never in daytrading.
-----------------------------------------------------
I fought that saying when I was at Schonfeld. I use to argue the point against Victor Neder...and his Spec List Group all the time back then. But right under my very eyes, the key traders that were making serious money (Other than Mr. Rearden) were not day trading, they were building portfolios. Two years later...BAM ASSET MANAGEMENT was formed and Schony became a partner.
As I watched all my friends start to hold positions for months, I still fell into the trap of 'SOES BANDENT ENGERGY' and the "Excitement" of day trading. And my ventures in day trading in Chicago with Schonfeld were more than exciting.
Of course I found an opportunity to jump ship and end up in the PE world having far more fun and success than I did in my ventures of day trading.
There will always be the Few who make money for what ever reasons... But Day Trading seems to be dead except for the few on Elite Trader. The wash out was huge since 08 and the new regs seem to really put the Nail in the whole deal.
Most day traders on ET sound like retired folks who are not trading for a living but trading to supplement their income, which I can understand.
Quote from EMRGLOBAL:
The real money was never in daytrading.
-----------------------------------------------------
I fought that saying when I was at Schonfeld. I use to argue the point against Victor Neder...and his Spec List Group all the time back then. But right under my very eyes, the key traders that were making serious money (Other than Mr. Rearden) were not day trading, they were building portfolios. Two years later...BAM ASSET MANAGEMENT was formed and Schony became a partner.
As I watched all my friends start to hold positions for months, I still fell into the trap of 'SOES BANDENT ENGERGY' and the "Excitement" of day trading. And my ventures in day trading in Chicago with Schonfeld were more than exciting.
Of course I found an opportunity to jump ship and end up in the PE world having far more fun and success than I did in my ventures of day trading.
There will always be the Few who make money for what ever reasons... But Day Trading seems to be dead except for the few on Elite Trader. The wash out was huge since 08 and the new regs seem to really put the Nail in the whole deal.
Most day traders on ET sound like retired folks who are not trading for a living but trading to supplement their income, which I can understand.
Daytrading defeats many or most amateurs. No surprise there. As always with failed amateurs they switch the blame elsewhere and typically try to pin all or most of the blame on daytrading as a mode of trading.
But actually its only about being unsuccessful; it just happens to be daytrading. At institutional and big player level trading IS judged on a per day basis. They don't use the description 'daytrading' but they often do nail down their success to 'per day' results and analysis.
Daytrading is a huge opportunity, continuously, and particularly so when you choose a volatile market (eg CL). But the failing amateur is defeated twice over: firstly being unable to get in his mind a stable order of viewing live data (namely price gyrations on charts with whatever contexts/lines/indicators that are needed) and secondly being unable to function properly without a suitable trading temperament (calm, robust, unstressed playing).
You know nothing about Bruce Lee.
Quote from jem:
It funny, when I watch those bruce lee snipets... I am impressed by the delivery, by the act... it was awesome. I want to know who his acting coach and agent and pr coaches were. What I see is an actor, selling his guruishness. His delivery was awesome. It was a beautiful act.
as far as content -- "be water my friend"..... what a bunch of fake zen garbage. Be a rehearsed "IED" my friend would make far more sense.
Bruce Lee was a rehearsed marketing IED, pretending he was being water.
It reminds me of the act all those those other martial arts guy used to get away with until... MMA.
Those guys must have had a martial arts acting school.
course 1. Become proficient at a martial art.
Course 2. How to pretend to be a wise man full of insight
course 3. how to pretend to be a mystic.
course 4, how to be pretend to be a guru.
course 5, how to get create a marketable product and cash in.
Quote from EPrado:
God are you so full of shit. I don't know where to start.
1) Rearden was one of MANY guys who did GREAT while daytrading at Schonfeld. The problem is, fools like you started during the boom/easy days and never correctly learned how to trade. There was a period of time when all one had to do was type in 4 letters and hit the buy button. Then things got tough and most of the guys like you were washed out. When I started in 1991 day trading was good, but you had to work at it. Then the easy times came when EVERYONE was making money(like you), not much skill needed. Guys with no risk management skills got bailed out all the time. Then in 2003 or so things got a bit tougher and you had to again work at it. Now...things are tough, but if you put the time in and work your ass off, there is a ton of money to be made. Plenty of us around daytrading stocks, futures, etc and doing very well. The problem is, a lot of traders are still stuck in the 1998-2003 timeframe when you could hit homeruns 4 days a week. These guys refuse to adjust and just bleed money over time. Daytrading is far from dead....you just have to work VERY hard these days.
2) Vic Neiderhoffer....GREAT example. Not shocking that you worship a blowout trader. VN is a very bright guy and probably a good guy. But...he is a HORRIBLE trader. Here's a guy who has no idea what the words risk management mean. Sure he had a few nice runs, but he blew out twice losing all his investors money. What good does it do anyone who had money with him if the end result was they lost everything. Not once , but twice.
3) BAM. Do yourself a favor. Think, do some research before you spout things you have no idea about. DB was by far the best daytrader/trader ever to trade at Schonfeld....made his fortune that enabled him to start BAM by daytrading/short term trading. You are a bigshot.....I am sure you know someone who can explain to you what happened when DB got away from short term trading. I am sure even to this day he still does short term/day trading type strategies. There is another guy who is kind of big who does some daytrading as well....his name is Stevie.......something........ummm.....Stevie Cohen...that's it. I am pretty sure I would listen to a guy like him who has been a top fund mananger for a long time, then some blowout trader like VN.
4) SOES bandit energy ? Correct me genius...but by the time you and the other 60 guys were hired in like one week at Schonfeld arrived, SOES-trading was long gone.
5) You are a huge PE guy...we get it. You do mega deals all over the world from your loft in Texas. Then go to Ibiza in the summer. What's your next trip? Miami Beach in August? Back to Chicago in February? I got approached by a PE guy like you a few months ago. About some oil deal in Texas. Probably a friend of yours. Was so beyond full of shit....sounds like someone I know. He claimed that Crude was going to hit 140 by June 1. Anyone who invested in his plot of dirt would be rich. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ.....people like you should stick to running infomercials at 3 a.m.
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